Win Today: Your Roadmap to Wholeness

Something happened that you cannot explain, and none of the explanations you have been handed since hold any weight. You prayed the prayer of faith. You declared the promise out loud. The outcome you were certain of never arrived. What you are left holding is a faith that worked exactly as it was supposed to and a grief it did nothing to prevent. Bethany Wohrle joins me for one of the rawest conversations this show has hosted. Bethany leads worship for Bethel Music, and in 2020 her family walked through the unthinkable: her five-month-old niece died suddenly, with no cause an autopsy could ever name. Bethany declared healing over her on the way to the hospital. She did not get her miracle. What she got instead was a confrontation with the difference between faith that manipulates outcomes and faith that survives losing them, and that confrontation is the spine of this conversation.
You know the pull toward turning Jesus into a good luck charm, a rabbit's foot you rub until He hands over the result you have decided you are owed. Bethany will not let either of us get away with that. We talk through what grief does to a body, what a sacrifice of praise actually costs, what to do the night foreboding fear shows up uninvited, and why surrendering your right to understand is not ignorance but wisdom. This conversation will not hand you a resolution. It will ask whether your faith can still worship in the room where the miracle did not happen.
Guest Bio
Bethany Wohrle is a worship leader with Bethel Music and has been part of the Collective since 2018. Originally from Florida, she began leading worship young in her local church before relocating with her family to Redding, California, and later serving on staff as a worship pastor in Lubbock, Texas. Bethany now lives in Nashville with her husband, Chris, and their two sons, and her debut solo album, Reason That I Sing, was written in the years following the sudden death of her infant niece.
Show Partner
SafeSleeve designs a phone case that blocks up to 99% of harmful EMF radiation—so I'm not carrying that kind of exposure next to my body all day. It's sleek, durable, and most importantly, lab-tested by third parties. The results aren't hidden—they're published right on their site. And that matters because many so-called EMF blockers on the market either don't work or can't prove they do. We protect our hearts and minds—why wouldn't we protect our bodies too? Head to safesleevecases.com and use the code WINTODAY10 for 10% off your order.
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Episode Links
Show Notes
Buy my book "Healing What You Can't Erase" here!
Invite me to speak at your church or event.
Connect with me @WINTODAYChris on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, and YouTube.

Something shifts in the middle of life that you were not warned about. The fervor you once had—the fire, the sense that God was close, and the faith was vivid—has gone flat. And the question underneath your silence, the one you are ashamed to admit, is not "What happened to my faith?" It is "What is wrong with me?" Nothing is wrong with you. But something is forming inside you, whether you know it or not. Whether it becomes maturity or bitterness depends on decisions you are probably not aware you are making right now.
Father Ronald Rolheiser—Missionary Oblate priest, theologian, and author of Insane for the Light and Sacred Fire—returns for a third conversation that opens the map most of us are missing.
He walks through the three phases of a maturing Christian life, explains why wilderness seasons are not a malfunction but a form of purification, and addresses why the grief you keep deferring is the precise bridge to everything the second half of life is supposed to be. Underneath all of it is the one question midlife forces everyone to answer: whether you are still operating out of the pleasure principle, asking what is in it for you, or whether you have begun the long work of moving from achievement to fruitfulness.
If you are in the flat middle stretch of life, this conversation will name exactly where you are. What comes after the naming is up to you. The Lord is not asking you to feel more. He is asking you to be honest, to grieve faithfully, and to hold with both hands whatever commitments He has already placed in yours.
Guest Bio
Father Ronald Rolheiser is a Missionary Oblate priest, theologian, and the author of Insane for the Light and Sacred Fire—among nearly twenty books exploring what it means to mature in a life with God. His weekly column on spirituality reaches readers in more than seventy countries. This is his third conversation on Win Today.
Show Partner
SafeSleeve designs a phone case that blocks up to 99% of harmful EMF radiation—so I'm not carrying that kind of exposure next to my body all day. It's sleek, durable, and most importantly, lab-tested by third parties. The results aren't hidden—they're published right on their site. And that matters because many so-called EMF blockers on the market either don't work or can't prove they do. We protect our hearts and minds—why wouldn't we protect our bodies too? Head to safesleevecases.com and use the code WINTODAY10 for 10% off your order.
Episode Links
Show Notes
Buy my book "Healing What You Can't Erase" here!
Invite me to speak at your church or event.
Connect with me @WINTODAYChris on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, and YouTube.

Somewhere between the prayer requests, the small group answers, and the service rotation, you stopped following Jesus and started working for him. You know what this feels like: the quiet exhaustion under the faithfulness, the sense that God has become an employer and you have become an employee who can never clock enough hours. Tim Timmons joins me from a place most people never reach: 25 years into an incurable cancer diagnosis, months past the death of his best friend, and more alive in Jesus than he has ever been.
Tim is the co-writer of MercyMe's Grammy-nominated "Even If" and the subject of the film I Can Only Imagine 2. We move into the distinction Tim names plainly: working for God is exhausting, and he quit. What replaced it is not resignation; it is something wilder and more demanding, the daily decision to join Jesus in the present moment rather than perform for an audience of One who never asked for the performance. We confront the Christian platitudes that gaslight grieving people, the real distance between surrender and contentment (they are not the same thing, and one of them can be done in fury), and what it looks like to wrestle with God well without letting go.
If you have been managing God's opinion of you rather than following him, this conversation will not comfort you. It will ask you to stop performing and start joining, which is harder and more alive. The question Tim keeps returning to across 25 years of manure and mystery is available to you right now: what if Jesus is here, at work, and not asking for your performance? Stop pretending you have already answered it.
Guest Bio
Tim Timmons is a Nashville-based singer, songwriter, and worship leader who has spent 25 years living with an incurable stage four cancer diagnosis and has emerged not with answers but with something better: a practice. He co-wrote MercyMe's Grammy-nominated "Even If," is the subject of the film I Can Only Imagine 2 (portrayed by Milo Ventimiglia), and recently released Waking Up Again: A Journey of Grief and Gratitude with his wife Hillary. He leads 10,000 Minutes, a nonprofit and podcast built around the question of what happens when Jesus people actually join Jesus in the 10,000 minutes outside of Sunday.
Show Partner
SafeSleeve designs a phone case that blocks up to 99% of harmful EMF radiation—so I'm not carrying that kind of exposure next to my body all day. It's sleek, durable, and most importantly, lab-tested by third parties. The results aren't hidden—they're published right on their site. And that matters because many so-called EMF blockers on the market either don't work or can't prove they do. We protect our hearts and minds—why wouldn't we protect our bodies too? Head to safesleevecases.com and use the code WINTODAY10 for 10% off your order.
Episode Links
Show Notes
Buy my book "Healing What You Can't Erase" here!
Invite me to speak at your church or event.
Connect with me @WINTODAYChris on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, and YouTube.

You already know something is off. The output is there. You're showing up, doing the work, performing at a level other people can see. But underneath all of it, there's a strain you can't quite name — a low-grade exhaustion that has nothing to do with how many hours you slept and everything to do with why you're doing what you're doing. You are working for your identity instead of from it. And no amount of productivity is going to fix a motivation problem. Pentatonix's Kevin Olusola and Donovan Dee Donnell join me today for a riveting conversation.
Kevin Olusola, Grammy-winning beatboxer and member of Pentatonix, and Donovan Dee Donnell, life coach, counselor, and co-author of Designed to Succeed, join me for one of the most theologically loaded conversations this show has ever had. Kevin names something with startling precision: he gave up the ghost — not as resignation, but as full surrender to the Father at the Hollywood Bowl in 2022, performing before thousands without needing their applause because his being was finally more secure than his doing.
Donovan unpacks the mechanics of fear with the clarity of someone who has lived in both the wreckage and the rebuild, walking us through what he and Kevin call the verify-purify-occupy framework, the three-move sequence for dismantling fear's claim before it ever gains a foothold. Together, they trace a thread that runs from identity through core values, through alignment and its guardrails, to the question every person of purpose will eventually have to answer: What are you willing to die for?
This is not a conversation about success. It is a conversation about what happens when your motivation is finally honest enough to be sanctified. It will ask you to do something you have probably been postponing — to go to God with the actual thing, not the acceptable version of it, and let Him work with what is true.
Guest Bios
Kevin Olusola is a three-time Grammy Award-winning musician and beatboxer best known as a member of Pentatonix, the a cappella group that has amassed nearly five billion streams on YouTube. A Yale University graduate who came within a semester of a pre-med track, Kevin traded the expectations of his immigrant Nigerian-Grenadian family for a music career built on the unconventional combination of classical cello and beatboxing — and paid for that leap in ways that eventually led him to something more costly than a career pivot: a genuine reckoning with why he was performing at all. He is also the founder of Imagine Faith Talk, where his platform merges high-performance principles with a Pentecostal-Charismatic faith, and the author of a solo musical project, Dawn of a Misfit.
Donovan Dee Donnell is a life coach, former counselor, and co-author of Designed to Succeed. A self-described introvert with an extrovert's calling, Donovan brings both the rigor of professional coaching and the honesty of someone who has navigated some dark places — including years as a stripper and a long reckoning with what it costs to build a life that isn't afraid of criticism. He is a founding collaborator on the Imagine Faith Talk platform alongside Kevin Olusola, and his coaching work centers on helping people identify the guardrails that protect alignment and do the internal work necessary to keep their motivation honest.
Show Partner
SafeSleeve designs a phone case that blocks up to 99% of harmful EMF radiation—so I'm not carrying that kind of exposure next to my body all day. It's sleek, durable, and most importantly, lab-tested by third parties. The results aren't hidden—they're published right on their site. And that matters because many so-called EMF blockers on the market either don't work or can't prove they do. We protect our hearts and minds—why wouldn't we protect our bodies too? Head to safesleevecases.com and use the code WINTODAY10 for 10% off your order.
Episode Links
Show Notes
Buy my book "Healing What You Can't Erase" here!
Invite me to speak at your church or event.
Connect with me @WINTODAYChris on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, and YouTube.

You have found ways to make your wound productive. You turned the thing that broke you into the engine that drives you — and somewhere along the way, you started calling that a superpower. You are high-functioning and deeply exhausted, achieving without arriving, performing your way through life while something underneath quietly starves.
Patrick Lencioni is the founder of The Table Group and the author behind some of the most influential business books of the last twenty years, including The Five Dysfunctions of a Team. But this conversation goes somewhere his work rarely takes him. Patrick opens up about his own diagnosis with OCD — the fear-driven, control-seeking, maniacal cycle of obsession and compulsion — and the childhood wounds that fed it for decades before anyone named what was happening. He and Christopher go deep on the real definition of OCD, its subtypes, including scrupulosity, and the specific way anxiety disorders attach themselves to the things of God and masquerade as faith. They also walk through what the dark night of the soul actually strips from a person — and why that stripping is not punishment but surgery. And Patrick makes the case for something the culture cannot stomach: that refusing to speak truth to someone you love is not kindness. It is cruelty wearing a gentler name.
If you have been performing your faith without living it, checking instead of trusting, arranging your world in exchange for a sense of safety that never quite holds, this conversation is going to name something you have been carrying for a long time. Patrick is not talking from a safe distance. He is still at work. So is Christopher. And what they both know now is that the wound does not become anything worth having until surrender has gone all the way down. That kind of surrender is not passive. It is the hardest thing a person ever does. This conversation will ask you to begin it.
Guest Bio
Patrick Lencioni is the founder and president of The Table Group, a firm dedicated to helping leaders build healthy organizations, and the author of 10 books on leadership and teamwork, with over 3 million copies sold worldwide. His best-known work, The Five Dysfunctions of a Team, has become one of the most widely used business texts in the world, applied by organizations ranging from the Fortune 500 to the military to the local church. He lives and works out of the Franklin, Tennessee area.
Show Partner
SafeSleeve designs a phone case that blocks up to 99% of harmful EMF radiation—so I'm not carrying that kind of exposure next to my body all day. It's sleek, durable, and most importantly, lab-tested by third parties. The results aren't hidden—they're published right on their site. And that matters because many so-called EMF blockers on the market either don't work or can't prove they do. We protect our hearts and minds—why wouldn't we protect our bodies too? Head to safesleevecases.com and use the code WINTODAY10 for 10% off your order.
Episode Links
Show Notes
Buy my book "Healing What You Can't Erase" here!
Invite me to speak at your church or event.
Connect with me @WINTODAYChris on Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, and YouTube.