Make It Weirder: Poet Maggie Smith on Success, Vulnerability & Creating Through Uncertainty
This episode is a dream come true. Kat sits down with the extraordinary Maggie Smith —poet, bestselling author, and creative soul behind the viral poem Good Bones and the memoir You Could Make This Place Beautiful. In this raw and inspiring conversation, they explore the messiness of the creative process, navigating visibility, staying true to your art in the age of AI, and how to keep going when the world (or your family) doesn’t get it.Whether you're an artist, writer, or creative entrepreneur, this episode is a love letter to your weird, beautiful, evolving path.In this episode, we talk about:* How Good Bones changed Maggie’s life—and what came next* The pain of success not being celebrated by the people closest to you* Why consistency looks different for every artist (especially caretakers!)* The trap of turning your creativity into a product* How to write honestly without sacrificing safety or boundaries* The importance of keeping your art for you—even when others are watching💬 Favorite Quotes:“Make it weirder. That’s the best writing advice I’ve ever given myself.”“Sometimes you have to pretend no one is watching so you can make what’s real.”“We don’t get health insurance from poetry. But we do get meaning.”“I realized I was folding tiny socks while my poem was going viral.”“You know who your real friends are not just when things go wrong—but when things go right.”🎤 About Maggie Smith:Maggie Smith is the author of several bestselling books, including You Could Make This Place Beautiful, Goldenrod, Keep Moving, and the viral poem Good Bones, which was called “the official poem of 2016” by Public Radio International and read by Meryl Streep at Lincoln Center. Her work has appeared in The New York Times, The New Yorker, The Paris Review, and Best American Poetry.A recipient of fellowships from the National Endowment for the Arts and the Ohio Arts Council, Smith is also the author of the forthcoming Dear Writer: Pep Talks & Practical Advice for the Creative Life (April 2025, Atria/Simon & Schuster). She teaches in the MFA program at the Naslund-Mann Graduate School of Writing and lives in Ohio.Find her at www.maggiesmithpoet.com and @maggiesmithpoet on social media.📚 Books Mentioned:* Dear Writer: Pep Talks & Practical Advice for the Creative Life* You Could Make This Place Beautiful* Good Bones* Keep Moving* Goldenrod✨ Sponsor: Create! MagazineSupport artist-run, independent publishing. Submit your work or subscribe digitally to stay inspired.📖 Transcript(Lightly edited)Kat: Maggie, welcome to Art & Cocktails. I am so unbelievably honored to have you on the show. I’ll tell you a fun story—I had jury duty in March, and I just grabbed a random book off my shelf… and it happened to be your memoir. I was so happy to have jury duty because I could binge-read it—I pretty much read the whole thing that afternoon.Thank you for writing it. And now you have a brand-new book out—Dear Writer. Congratulations! It’s filled with incredible tools and lessons for the creative life. I can’t wait to jump in.Maggie: Oh my gosh, that’s so kind. Thanks for having me!On Becoming a WriterKat: For those who may not be familiar with your work, could you tell us a little bit about who you are and what you do?Maggie: I’m primarily a poet—that’s probably how most people know me. But I also publish prose, picture books, and work in other genres. I’m a writer, teacher, sometimes an editor… and a Midwesterner.Kat: I love that. How did you know you wanted to commit your life to writing?Maggie: I always felt writing was the thing I was best at—and the thing that made me feel most like myself. I probably knew in college that I’d be writing poems the rest of my life. I had no idea how I’d pay my bills—but the writing part was never in question.On Impractical Dreams and Real-World PressureKat: What would you say to someone who loves creating but is stuck in a job that feels draining?Maggie: I actually tell people to keep the day job. It gives you financial stability and protects your creativity from pressure. I had a 9-to-5 job for years after my MFA. It let me write at night and didn’t require grading or student emails.Creativity doesn’t owe you a paycheck. When we force it to pay rent, it can shift the relationship—and not in a good way.When “Good Bones” Went ViralKat: Tell me about when Good Bones went viral—where were you in life at that time?Maggie: I was pushing a stroller around my neighborhood and folding tiny socks. I had two young kids and was very much in mom-mode. It was surreal. Suddenly people who had no idea who I was—musicians, actors, chefs—were sharing my poem.I had to quickly decide how to keep writing and not get stuck in “performance” mode. I had to pretend it never happened and return to writing like no one was watching.On Jealousy, Sabotage & Who Really Shows UpKat: You’ve written about unsupportive friends or family. How do you deal with that when your career starts to grow?Maggie: It’s painful—but also clarifying. You really do learn who your people are. Not just when things go wrong, but when they go right.Someone else’s success doesn’t take anything from you. It just adds more to the well. I try to keep that in mind, even when I’m personally disappointed.On Redefining “Consistency” for Creative PeopleKat: Your new book redefines consistency in such a refreshing way. Can you share your view?Maggie: The creative process shouldn’t hurt. Some days are writing days, some aren’t. If I’m not writing, I do something in service of my writing—edit an old draft, submit work, organize.It all counts. Taking a walk, calling a friend, doing yoga—those things fill the well too.On Telling the Truth SafelyKat: What advice do you have for someone who wants to tell a vulnerable story but is scared?Maggie: Write it all—but don’t feel pressure to publish it all. Publishing is very different from writing. Ask: “Would I be okay answering questions about this publicly?” If not, can you revise or set a boundary while keeping the heart of the story?Be honest, but protect your peace.On Art, AI, and Why It’s Time to Get WeirdKat: In this AI-saturated world, what’s your advice to creatives?Maggie: I have a sticky note on my desk that says: “Make it weirder.” That’s my guiding principle. I want to feel the human behind the work—the mess, the quirks, the seams.AI can’t grieve. It can’t love. It can’t dream. We can. That’s our power.ClosingKat: Maggie, thank you so much for your time and wisdom. Your work is such a gift.Maggie: Thank you. This was a joy. Get full access to Art & Cocktails by Ekaterina Popova at artandcocktails.substack.com/subscribe
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