BetterHealthGuy Podcast

🎧 Episode Summary
In this special episode, Neil Nathan, MD and Dr. Ritchie Shoemaker, MD come together to share their distinct perspectives on mold-related illness and Chronic Inflammatory Response Syndrome (CIRS). 
Drawing on decades of clinical experience and research, they explore where their approaches converge and differ across diagnosis, urine mycotoxin testing, MARCoNS, GENIE, environmental assessment, Actinobacteria, nervous system regulation, VIP, treatment approaches, and overall recovery. 
The conversation offers two evolving perspectives on complex chronic illness with a shared goal of helping patients regain health and resilience.
🧭 In This Episode
- Treatment models for mold illness and CIRS, including key drivers and foundational pillars of recovery
- HLA-DR testing and its role in susceptibility, clinical decision-making, and recovery potential
- Biotoxin blood markers for diagnosis, treatment planning, and monitoring progress
- Urine mycotoxin testing, including accuracy, interpretation, limitations, and clinical utility
- VCS, NeuroQuant, GENIE, and organic acids as tools for clinical assessment and treatment direction
- MARCoNS, the sinubiome, and their potential significance in mold-related illness and CIRS
- Environmental assessment using ERMI, HERTSMI-2, air sampling, and indoor environmental professionals
- Nervous system dysfunction involving the limbic system, vagus nerve, dysautonomia, and mast cell activation
- Coagulation abnormalities and their potential significance in CIRS
- Prescription and natural binders and their role in treatment
- Fungal colonization and the role of antifungal treatment
- Actinobacteria and endotoxins as potential contributors to CIRS
- VIP and its potential role in treatment
- Recovery endpoints and the factors involved in restoring health and resilience
👥 About the Guests
Neil Nathan, MD is a leading clinician in the treatment of mold illness, Lyme disease, chemical sensitivities, and other complex chronic conditions, and is the author of several books including Toxic and The Sensitive Patient's Healing Guide.
Connect With the Guest
Website - https://neilnathanmd.com
Ritchie Shoemaker, MD is a pioneer in the field of biotoxin illness and the developer of the Chronic Inflammatory Response Syndrome, or CIRS, model.  He is the author of several books including Mold Warriors and Surviving Mold.
Connect With the Guest
Website - https://www.cirsx.com
Interview Date: August 13, 2026
🔗 Related Resources
Detection of Mycotoxins in Patients with Chronic Fatigue Syndrome - https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/23580077
Biochemical Markers in the Urine Associated with Gastrointestinal Mold-Overgrowth Are Linked with Elevated Urinary Mycotoxins in Patients with Suspected Mold Illness - https://townsendletter.com/biochemical-markers-in-the-urine-associated-with-gi-mold-overgorwth-shaw-and-pratt-hyatt
Clearance of multiple antibiotic-resistant coagulase-negative staphylococci is selectively associated with higher circulating α-melanocyte stimulating hormone in patients evaluated for chronic inflammatory response syndrome - https://www.frontiersin.org/journals/endocrinology/articles/10.3389/fendo.2026.1728408/full
Pitfalls of Mycotoxin Testing: Evidence-Based Findings Confirm Mycotoxin Assays Using Antibody Testing and Urinary ELISA Are Based on Flawed Science - https://esmed.org/MRA/mra/article/view/7260
Transcriptomic Parkinson's Prodrome and its Correction by Vasoactive Intestinal Polypeptide in Chronic Inflammatory Response Syndrome - https://esmed.org/MRA/mra/article/view/7608
📄 Transcript
Review a transcript of this episode:
https://betterhealthguy.com/ep238
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ℹ️ Disclaimer
The content of this show is for informational purposes only and is not intended to diagnose, treat, or cure any illness or medical condition. Nothing in today's discussion is meant to serve as medical advice or as information to facilitate self-treatment. As always, please discuss any potential health-related decisions with your own personal medical authority.

🎧 Episode Summary
Emily Gutierrez, DNP, C-PNP, CCN, IFMCP, FMAPS explores the brain-folate connection and the role of cerebral folate deficiency in autism, PANS/PANDAS, and neurodevelopmental health. She explains how folate supports DNA synthesis, myelination, neurotransmitter production, and other critical functions in the brain, while highlighting how blood folate levels may appear normal even when folate availability in the central nervous system is inadequate.
The conversation examines folate receptor alpha autoantibodies and the mechanisms that can interfere with folate transport into the brain. Dr. Gutierrez discusses their significant overlap with autism and PANS/PANDAS, the potential contributions of mitochondrial dysfunction and genomic variants, and the use of the Folate Receptor Antibody Test (FRAT) to identify blocking and binding autoantibodies. She explores dietary, inflammatory, and immune factors that may influence folate receptor autoimmunity and cerebral folate availability.
Dr. Gutierrez discusses folinic acid and prescription leucovorin as strategies to increase folate availability in the brain, including dosing, titration, potential side effects, and factors that may influence treatment response. She explains how higher doses may utilize alternative folate transport mechanisms, why addressing inflammation, infections, and nutrient cofactors may be important, and how restoring adequate folate availability may support language, development, neurological function, and resilience.
🧭 In This Episode
- Cerebral folate deficiency and impaired folate availability in the brain
- Folate receptor alpha autoantibodies and their effect on folate transport
- Autism and PANS/PANDAS prevalence in cerebral folate deficiency
- Mitochondrial dysfunction and energy-dependent folate transport
- FRAT testing for folate receptor alpha autoantibodies
- Blocking, binding, and soluble folate receptor findings and clinical severity
- Folate receptor autoantibodies and fluctuations in folate transport
- Genomic variants and their relationship to folate metabolism and FRAT positivity
- Dietary folic acid and dairy considerations with folate receptor autoantibodies
- Inflammation, infections, nutrient cofactors, and preparation for high-dose folinic acid
- Leucovorin dosing and clinical response to folinic acid
- Folinic acid side effects and its relationship to tetrahydrobiopterin
- High-dose folinic acid and alternative folate transport mechanisms
- Immune dysregulation and folate receptor autoimmunity in autism
👤 About the Guest
Emily Gutierrez, DNP, C-PNP, CCN, IFMCP, FMAPS is a doctorally prepared nurse practitioner and nationally recognized expert in functional medicine.
With advanced clinical training in both pediatric and adult care, she brings a root-cause, evidence-based approach to optimizing neurological and mental health across the lifespan.
As a Doctor of Nursing Practice (DNP) from Johns Hopkins University, Dr. Gutierrez specializes in translational medicine; applying the latest scientific research to real-world patient care. She has served as adjunct faculty at Johns Hopkins University for six years, teaching integrative and functional health.
She is a Fellow of the Medical Academy of Pediatric Special Needs (MAPS), an Institute for Functional Medicine Certified Practitioner (IFM-CP), a Certified Clinical Nutritionist (CCN), and a Primary Care Mental Health Specialist (PCMHS). Her clinical background includes extensive training in neuronutrition, genomics, and integrative strategies to support complex mental health and neurodevelopmental conditions.
In her role as Chief Scientific Medical Liaison and Formulator for Neuro Nutrients, she develops clinically informed, research-backed supplements that support brain function, mood balance, and overall neurological resilience; designed for both pediatric and adult populations.
Connect With the Guest
Website - https://neuronutritionassociates.com
YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@neuronutritionassociates184
Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/neuronutritionassociates
Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/neuronutritionassociates
Interview Date: August 7, 2026
🔗 Related Resources
Neuro Nutrients - https://www.neuronutrients.com
In her role as Chief Scientific Officer and Formulator for Neuro Nutrients, Dr. Gutierrez develops clinically informed, research-backed supplements that support brain function, mood balance, and overall neurological resilience.
Folate Receptor Antibody Test - https://www.fratnow.com
FRAT® was developed in the lab of Dr. Edward Quadros at the State University of NY (SUNY Downstate) and is the only assay available that can screen for both blocking and binding folate receptor autoantibodies.
📄 Transcript
Review a transcript of this episode:
https://betterhealthguy.com/ep237
☕ Support the Show
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ℹ️ Disclaimer
The content of this show is for informational purposes only and is not intended to diagnose, treat, or cure any illness or medical condition. Nothing in today's discussion is meant to serve as medical advice or as information to facilitate self-treatment. As always, please discuss any potential health-related decisions with your own personal medical authority.

🎧 Episode Summary
Jason Hawrelak, ND, PhD explores the central role of the gut microbiome in shaping human health, explaining how the trillions of microorganisms that inhabit the gastrointestinal tract influence immunity, metabolism, brain function, inflammation, and resilience. Drawing on more than two decades of research and clinical experience, he discusses how modern lifestyles, antibiotic exposure, processed foods, and environmental factors have altered the diversity of the human microbiome and contributed to the growing burden of chronic disease.
The conversation examines the balance between beneficial microbes, pathobionts, and pathogens, highlighting the importance of microbial diversity, short-chain fatty acid production, intestinal pH, and ecological balance rather than simply eliminating unwanted organisms. Dr. Hawrelak shares practical insights into microbiome testing, comparing culture, PCR, 16S sequencing, and shotgun metagenomics while explaining how these tools can guide personalized interventions to restore healthier microbial ecosystems.
Dr. Hawrelak also discusses the microbiome's role in conditions such as IBS, SIBO, inflammatory bowel disease, Candida overgrowth, and systemic inflammation. He explains how dietary strategies, prebiotics, probiotics, herbal medicines, and targeted microbiome support can improve gut ecology, reduce inflammatory burden, optimize digestive function, and promote lasting health throughout the body.
🧭 In This Episode
- The evolution of microbiome research over the past 25 years
- Why the gut microbiome functions like another human organ
- Microbial diversity, richness, and ecosystem resilience
- The microbiome's influence on immunity, inflammation, and brain health
- Dysbiosis, leaky gut, and the roots of chronic disease
- Butyrate, short-chain fatty acids, and microbial metabolites
- Beneficial microbes, pathobionts, and microbial balance
- Akkermansia, Proteobacteria, Bacteroides, and gut ecology
- Prebiotics, dietary fiber, polyphenols, and microbiome restoration
- Lactulose as a powerful microbiome-modulating prebiotic
- SIBO, methane, motility, and the migrating motor complex
- Shotgun metagenomics, 16S sequencing, PCR, and stool testing
- Crohn's disease, ulcerative colitis, and microbiome-targeted therapies
- Candida, the mycobiome, and fungal overgrowth
- Colonic pH, digestive health, and ecological balance
- Practical strategies for optimizing the microbiome and overall health
👤 About the Guest
Jason Hawrelak, ND, PhD is a researcher, educator, Western herbalist, and naturopathic physician with over 25 years of clinical experience.  He earned his PhD examining the capacity of probiotics, prebiotics, and herbal medicines to modify the gastrointestinal microbiota and teaches worldwide on the topics of microbiota modification and gut health. He has published extensively in these areas, including 20 textbook chapters.
Dr. Hawrelak serves on the Medical Nutrition Council of the American Society for Nutrition and is a Fellow of both the American College of Nutrition and the Naturopaths and Herbalists Association of Australia.  
Dr. Hawrelak maintains a busy telehealth practice as lead clinician at the Hawrelak Gut and Microbiome Clinic.  Dr. Hawrelak is Chief Research Officer at Probiotic Advisor, which offers a searchable database that enables evidence-based prescribing of probiotic products.
Dr. Hawrelak also founded and serves as Lead Educator at the Microbiome Restoration Center, an online educational platform devoted to training health professionals to become microbiome clinicians through its flagship courses, Naturopathic and Functional Medicine Approaches to Gastrointestinal Disorders and Advanced Microbiome Manipulation.
Connect With the Guest
Website - https://microbiomerestorationcenter.com
Facebook - https://www.facebook.com/probioticadvisor
Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/probioticadvisor
Interview Date: June 21, 2026
🔗 Related Resources
Probiotic Advisor - https://www.probioticadvisor.com
ProbioticAdvisor.com provides independent, unbiased, evidence-based information on probiotics, their potential risks, and documented benefits.
📄 Transcript
Review a transcript of this episode:
https://betterhealthguy.com/ep236
☕ Support the Show
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ℹ️ Disclaimer
The content of this show is for informational purposes only and is not intended to diagnose, treat, or cure any illness or medical condition. Nothing in today's discussion is meant to serve as medical advice or as information to facilitate self-treatment. As always, please discuss any potential health-related decisions with your own personal medical authority.

🎧 Episode Summary
Christian Navarro-Torres, PhD shares his journey from cognitive neuroscientist and academic researcher to becoming a patient with severe CIRS, biotoxin illness, and extreme environmental hypersensitivity. Drawing from both scientific training and lived experience, he discusses how mold exposure, immune dysregulation, chronic infections, and microbial colonization shaped his understanding of complex chronic illness and led to the creation of CIRS Lab.
The conversation explores the evolving science of CIRS, including HLA genetics, innate immune activation, mycotoxins, transcriptomics testing through GENIE, and the potential roles of mold, endotoxins, beta-glucans, Actinobacteria, and chronic infections in driving persistent symptoms. Dr. Navarro-Torres also examines how nervous system dysregulation, trauma, neuroinflammation, and metabolic dysfunction may contribute to illness severity and recovery challenges.
Dr. Navarro-Torres suggests that recovery often requires looking beyond environmental exposures alone to address microbial burden, immune resilience, metabolic health, sinus health, and physiological repair. He emphasizes the importance of restoring interconnected systems that support long-term healing and improved adaptability.
🧭 In This Episode
- Dr. Navarro-Torres' journey from neuroscientist to CIRS patient
- Extreme hypersensitivity and reacting to everyday exposures
- Microdosing binders and treatments in sensitive patients
- Trauma, nervous system regulation, and chronic illness severity
- HLA genetics, mold exposure, and immune recognition
- GENIE testing and patterns of CIRS causation
- NeuroQuant findings in CIRS, inflammation, and brain recovery
- VIP, ProdromeGLIA, plasmalogens, and lipid support
- Environmental testing and remediation strategies
- Immune dysregulation, autoimmunity, and microbial burden
- MARCoNS, MSH, and sinus-related immune signaling
- SinusKEY, Actinobacteria, fungal DNA, and the sinubiome
- Actinobacteria, endotoxins, and illness persistence
- Lyme, Bartonella, Babesia, viruses, and parasites
- Gut health, SIBO, fungal colonization, and Long COVID
- Reintegration, resilience, and long-term recovery
👤 About the Guest
Christian Navarro-Torres, PhD is a cognitive neuroscientist with formal training in cognitive psychology, neuroscience, language science, and applied data analysis. He earned his PhD in Language Science from the University of California, Irvine, after completing an MS in Cognitive Psychology at Penn State and a BA in Philosophy from the University of Puerto Rico. His research career has included postdoctoral fellowships at Princeton University and at Georgetown University, where his work focused on the intersection between experience-dependent neuroplasticity and clinical assessment in patients with brain damage affecting language and cognition.
He is the Co-Founder of CIRS Lab, the Scientific Director of The CIRS Research Foundation, and a Research Consultant for the Einstein Mission, which investigates erythromelalgia and CIRS.
Christian's recent scientific work extends into environmental health and immune dysregulation, including publications and presentations on biotoxin illness, its multi-system and multi-symptom pathology, and treatment outcomes with a particular interest in how CIRS-related brain changes may contribute to processes of neurodegeneration.
Equally important, his mission is grounded in lived experience. He is a complex, hypersensitive patient who has endured serious microbial colonizations; an underappreciated and often overlooked issue in the mainstream mold illness community; alongside tick-borne and protozoal co-infections. These overlapping comorbidities created a perplexing clinical profile that demanded self-advocacy, where his scientific background became essential to navigating conflicting medical advice and fragmented care.
Drawing from both his expertise and his personal recovery journey, he now provides training for physicians and clinicians on how to identify, understand, and treat those with complex, multi-layered presentations.
Connect With the Guest
Website - https://cirslab.com
YouTube - https://www.youtube.com/@CIRSLab
Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/cirslab
Interview Date: May 27, 2026
🔗 Related Resources
MARCoNS Research Paper - https://www.frontiersin.org/journals/endocrinology/articles/10.3389/fendo.2026.1728408/full
Clearance of multiple antibiotic-resistant coagulase-negative staphylococci is selectively associated with higher circulating α-melanocyte stimulating hormone in patients evaluated for chronic inflammatory response syndrome

CIRS Research Foundation - https://cirs-research-foundation.org
Improving health outcomes globally through innovative research, education, and outreach

The Coherent Health Podcast - https://www.coherencedx.com
The Coherent Health Podcast with Lacey Venanzi, DC and Christian Navarro-Torres, PhD
📄 Transcript
Review a transcript of this episode:
https://betterhealthguy.com/ep235
☕ Support the Show
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🧭 My 16-Step Framework
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ℹ️ Disclaimer
The content of this show is for informational purposes only and is not intended to diagnose, treat, or cure any illness or medical condition. Nothing in today's discussion is meant to serve as medical advice or as information to facilitate self-treatment. As always, please discuss any potential health-related decisions with your own personal medical authority.

🎧 Episode Summary
Joshua Leisk continues the discussion of his systems biology model for ME/CFS, Long COVID, and related chronic illnesses, focusing on how lymphatic dysfunction, sympathetic nervous system dominance, metabolic impairment, and chronic stress responses may contribute to the persistence of complex chronic conditions. He explores the relationships between cortisol regulation, trauma, autonomic imbalance, energy metabolism, and the body's ability to maintain resilience and recovery.
The conversation examines how biofilms, chronic infections, viral reactivation, hypoxia, oxidative stress, and immune system blind spots may interact to drive ongoing symptoms and disease progression. Joshua discusses the potential roles of microbial adaptation, mitochondrial dysfunction, connective tissue disorders, circulatory challenges, and inflammatory signaling in creating self-perpetuating cycles of illness.
Joshua shares his perspective that meaningful recovery requires addressing the interconnected factors underlying chronic illness, including metabolism, nutrient status, autonomic regulation, lymphatic flow, structural integrity, and immune function. He suggests that restoring these foundational systems may help the body regain adaptability, improve cellular energy production, and support long-term healing.
🧭 In This Episode
- Lymphatic system function in detoxification, immune activity, and fat transport
- Lymphatic drainage approaches for supporting recovery and reducing bottlenecks
- Localized lymph node congestion as a clue to underlying infection sites
- Cortisol regulation and its relationship to metabolic dysfunction
- Complex PTSD and childhood trauma as contributors to autonomic dysregulation
- Sympathetic dominance, hypervigilance, and progression of chronic illness
- Vagal tone interventions and their relationship to underlying metabolism
- Biofilm formation and microbial life cycle transitions
- Immune system blind spots and limitations in biofilm surveillance
- Microbiome adaptation to sympathetic nervous system signaling
- Viral reactivation mechanisms involving hypoxia-inducible factor 1-alpha
- Hypoxia, oxygen transport dysfunction, and chronic illness progression
- Nitric oxide metabolism and circulatory regulation
- Connective tissue disorders, Ehlers-Danlos syndrome, and mitochondrial dysfunction
👤 About the Guest
Joshua Leisk is a biological engineer and independent researcher focused on complex chronic illness. He is the creator of Born Free, a patient-led community research project that develops models and potential interventions for conditions such as ME/CFS and Long COVID.
His work takes a systems biology, reverse engineering approach, exploring how disruptions in metabolism, mitochondrial function, and cellular signaling may contribute to chronic disease. He is known for developing detailed, evolving models that aim to explain how illness begins, progresses, and may potentially be reversed.
Joshua collaborates with a global community of patients, practitioners, and researchers, sharing pathway diagrams, hypotheses, and research intended to advance the understanding of complex chronic conditions.
He is a founder of the Collaborative Sciences Institute, which provides systems biology education for clinicians treating complex chronic disease. He is also involved with Renegade Research, a 501(c)(3) nonprofit bringing together patients, caregivers, scientists, and clinicians to drive innovation in healthcare.
Connect With the Guest
Website - https://bornfree.life
X - https://x.com/joshual_tm
Interview Date: May 13, 2026
🔗 Related Resources
Collaborative Sciences Institute - https://collabsci.org
Systems biology education for clinicians treating complex chronic disease
JoshuaLeisk.com - https://joshualeisk.com
Rethinking tomorrow's medicine, using a systems-based biological reverse engineering approach
📄 Transcript
Review a transcript of this episode:
https://betterhealthguy.com/ep234
☕ Support the Show
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🧭 My 16-Step Framework
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🌐 Additional Information
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ℹ️ Disclaimer
The content of this show is for informational purposes only and is not intended to diagnose, treat, or cure any illness or medical condition. Nothing in today's discussion is meant to serve as medical advice or as information to facilitate self-treatment. As always, please discuss any potential health-related decisions with your own personal medical authority.