De Facto Leaders

When you’re teaching storytelling with students, do your lessons feel kind of…random?I used to feel like this a lot when I was a school SLP, so if you’ve ever had a “throw spaghetti at the wall” therapy session that felt all over the place, I get it.The truth is, repetition and drill is not the enemy. If you ONLY focus on unstructured activities, you’re probably seeing students getting overwhelmed, not remembering to apply important language skills (like syntax, vocabulary words, etc). But if you ONLY stick with structured activities, kids never get the chance to apply and practice. That’s why leveraging books and story grammar as part of your “therapy toolkit” can be such a powerful tool to bridge this gap…even though many storytelling activities look like simple “cutesy” activities on the surface.(and if you understand the “why” it’s much easier to apply for older kids who are kind of over coming to therapy). In this second half of my interview with my colleague Jane Gebers, we talk about how to use tools like dynamic assessment and narrative intervention to make therapy structured, rigorous, and functional. Jane L. Gebers is the author of the popular resource, Books Are for Talking, Too!, first published in 1990, and now in its 4th edition as of March 2023. A practicing speech-language pathologist for over 40 years, she has worked in public school, hospital, private, and clinical settings. She has been an adjunct professor at St. Mary’s College of California and other universities where she taught Language Development, Assessment, and Intervention courses to students pursuing special education credentials. She currently holds a private practice in Northern California.You can connect with Jane on LinkedIn here: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jane-l-gebers-53856119/Email her at [email protected] more about her book, Books Are For Talking, Too! here: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0C2SG8J58?ref_=cm_sw_r_cp_ud_dp_RR4P3SB19A92WD6FPD3RLearn more about her storytelling resources and speech therapy services on her website here: http://soundingyourbest.com/In this episode, I mentioned Language Therapy Advance Foundations, my program that gives speech pathologists a framework for building language skills needed to thrive in school, social situations, and daily life. You can learn more about the program here: https://drkarenspeech.com/languagetherapyI also mentioned the Art and Science of Narrative Language, my program that gives speech pathologists and educational professionals a process for evaluating and supporting narrative language. You can learn more about the program here: https://drkarenspeech.lpages.co/art-science-narratives-blog-297/ We’re thrilled to be sponsored by IXL. IXL’s comprehensive teaching and learning platform for math, language arts, science, and social studies is accelerating achievement in 95 of the top 100 U.S. school districts. Loved by teachers and backed by independent research from Johns Hopkins University, IXL can help you do the following and more:Simplify and streamline technologySave teachers’ timeReliably meet Tier 1 standardsImprove student performance on state assessments🚀 Ready to see why leading districts trust IXL for their educational needs? Visit IXL.com/BE today to learn more about how IXL can elevate your school or district.

Why are we so obsessed with “storytelling”?In education, we talk about it when we’re working on language and reading comprehension. It’s also referred to in sales and copy writing as a tool for generating more leads and customers. And of course, people writing books or films think about it all the time. We all know storytelling is an important life skill. But do we remember HOW MUCH it can impact our ability to communicate and function? And do we know how to support students who don’t have this skill?I invited my colleague Jane Gebers to the De Facto Leaders podcast to discuss this topic. If you’re helping students build skills for functional daily tasks, challenging academic work, or in social situations, you won’t want to miss this conversation. In this first half of the interview, we talk about the “why” behind teaching narrative discourse, plus specific examples of how we’ve both used narrative structure to build our own comprehension.Jane L. Gebers is the author of the popular resource, Books Are for Talking, Too!, first published in 1990, and now in its 4th edition as of March 2023. A practicing speech-language pathologist for over 40 years, she has worked in public school, hospital, private, and clinical settings. She has been an adjunct professor at St. Mary’s College of California and other universities where she taught Language Development, Assessment, and Intervention courses to students pursuing special education credentials. She currently holds a private practice in Northern California.You can connect with Jane on LinkedIn here: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jane-l-gebers-53856119/Email her at [email protected] more about her book, Books Are For Talking, Too! here: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0C2SG8J58?ref_=cm_sw_r_cp_ud_dp_RR4P3SB19A92WD6FPD3RLearn more about her storytelling resources and speech therapy services on her website here: http://soundingyourbest.com/ In this episode, I mentioned Language Therapy Advance Foundations, my program that gives speech pathologists a framework for building language skills needed to thrive in school, social situations, and daily life. You can learn more about the program here: https://drkarenspeech.com/languagetherapyI also mentioned the Art and Science of Narrative Language, my program that gives speech pathologists and educational professionals a process for evaluating and supporting narrative language. You can learn more about the program here: https://drkarenspeech.lpages.co/art-science-narratives-blog-297/ We’re thrilled to be sponsored by IXL. IXL’s comprehensive teaching and learning platform for math, language arts, science, and social studies is accelerating achievement in 95 of the top 100 U.S. school districts. Loved by teachers and backed by independent research from Johns Hopkins University, IXL can help you do the following and more:Simplify and streamline technologySave teachers’ timeReliably meet Tier 1 standardsImprove student performance on state assessments🚀 Ready to see why leading districts trust IXL for their educational needs? Visit IXL.com/BE today to learn more about how IXL can elevate your school or district.

If your therapy techniques only work when you’re in the room, that’s a problem.Many therapists unintentionally “gatekeep” their expertise and miss opportunities to boost carryover.It’s the unexpected downside of being really good at direct clinical work. Don’t get me wrong. Clinical judgment does matter. And some things can only be addressed by a trained clinician in a therapy room.But when every decision depends on your personal expertise and physical presence, you’ve made yourself the bottleneck.In this episode, I’ll share how to make the shift towards clear, repeatable systems that others can follow. When you make your methods easier to teach, you make your work scalable, easier to delegate, and far more convincing to leadership.I’ll tackle common misconceptions like:✅ “I can’t delegate; I don’t have direct reports.”✅ “I don’t have time for consultation.”✅ “We never get enough time to work on skills.”Plus I share the three steps to making intervention “scalable” so your session plans can start doubling as consultation guides and training tools for others.In this episode, I mentioned Language Therapy Advance Foundations, my program that gives speech pathologists a framework for building language skills needed to thrive in school, social situations, and daily life. You can learn more about the program here: https://drkarenspeech.com/languagetherapyI also mentioned the School of Clinical Leadership, my program that helps related service providers develop scalable executive functioning strategies they can turn into schoolwide initiatives. You can learn more about the program here: https://drkarendudekbrannan.com/clinicalleadership We’re thrilled to be sponsored by IXL. IXL’s comprehensive teaching and learning platform for math, language arts, science, and social studies is accelerating achievement in 95 of the top 100 U.S. school districts. Loved by teachers and backed by independent research from Johns Hopkins University, IXL can help you do the following and more:Simplify and streamline technologySave teachers’ timeReliably meet Tier 1 standardsImprove student performance on state assessments🚀 Ready to see why leading districts trust IXL for their educational needs? Visit IXL.com/BE today to learn more about how IXL can elevate your school or district.

Where did arbitrary cut scores for norm-referenced language assessments come from, and why do they feel “safer” than relying on clinical judgement?I discuss this question and more in this third part of a three-part series, bilingual SLPs Destiny Johnson and Tiffany Shahoumian-Ruiz join me to continue our conversation about advocating for effective language evaluation practices in schools.Across these conversations, we explore:Sensitivity, specificity, reference standards, and diagnostic accuracyHow test development has evolved over time and why this matters Why the same cut-off score shouldn’t apply across all testsThe math behind using two norm-referenced tests, and why it may complicate rather than clarify in some casesOther reasons we test beyond diagnosis (treatment planning, severity, monitoring progress)How do we do we to “sell” the concept of dynamic assessment to administratorsCase studies that show the pitfalls of over-reliance on standardized scoresMisconceptions clinicians often hold, and what they should know about assessmentDifferences in state eligibility standards, and what this means for service decisionsThis series is part myth-busting, part practical strategies, and part advocacy playbook—perfect for clinicians who want to move beyond compliance-driven evaluations toward assessments that truly reflect students’ needs.Destiny Johnson, M.S., CCC-SLP, is a bilingual speech-language pathologist (English/Spanish) with a deep passion for culturally responsive assessment and treatment practices, as well as advocating for policy change. She has presented on dynamic assessment at the CSHA Convergence 2024, focusing on the importance of dynamic assessment in bilingual children. Destiny has experience working as a school-based SLP, in private practice, and in early intervention. She is also the founder and CEO of Multimodal Communication Speech Clinic P.C.Connect with Destiny on Instagram @destinyjohnsonslp, on her private practice website here, and on LinkedIn here.Listen to Destiny’s previous episode on De Facto Leaders here: EP 187: Dynamic Assessment: Evaluations are a process, not a test (with Destiny Johnson)Tiffany Shahoumian-Ruiz is a bilingual high school SLP from Southern California who has primarily worked in the school systems and has experience at both the elementary and secondary level. She’s also a member of Language Therapy Advance Foundations, and is involved in state and local advocacy work relating to dynamic assessments and special education eligibility.Connect with Tiffany on Instagram @tiffany.shahoumianListen to Tiffany’s previous episode on De Facto Leaders here: High school language therapy: Do we still have time to make an impact? (with Tiffany Shahoumian-Ruiz)In this episode, I mention Language Therapy Advance Foundations, my program that gives SLPs and other service providers a system for language therapy. You can learn more about the program here.Additional Resources Mentioned in the episode:Daub, O., Cunningham, B. J., Bagatto, M. P., Johnson, A. M., Kwok, E. Y., Smyth, R. E., & Oram Cardy, J. (2021). Adopting a conceptual validity framework for testing in speech-language pathology. American Journal of Speech-Language Pathology, 30(4), 1894–1908. https://doi.org/10.1044/2021_AJSLP-20-00032Spaulding, T. J., Plante, E., & Farinella, K. A. (2006). Eligibility criteria for language impairment: Is the low end of normal always appropriate? Language, Speech, and Hearing Services in Schools, 37(1), 61–72. https://doi.org/10.1044/0161-1461(2006/007)DYMOND Norm-Referenced Dynamic AssessmentBilingual English-Spanish Assessment (BESA) We’re thrilled to be sponsored by IXL. IXL’s comprehensive teaching and learning platform for math, language arts, science, and social studies is accelerating achievement in 95 of the top 100 U.S. school districts. Loved by teachers and backed by independent research from Johns Hopkins University, IXL can help you do the following and more:Simplify and streamline technologySave teachers’ timeReliably meet Tier 1 standardsImprove student performance on state assessments🚀 Ready to see why leading districts trust IXL for their educational needs? Visit IXL.com/BE today to learn more about how IXL can elevate your school or district.

When we choose evaluation tools for language, are we clear on WHY we’re assessing? Most people think of diagnosis, but that’s not the only reason we assess students. I discuss this question and more in this second part of a three-part series, bilingual SLPs Destiny Johnson and Tiffany Shahoumian-Ruiz join me to continue our conversation about language evaluation practices in schools.Across these conversations, we explore:Sensitivity, specificity, reference standards, and diagnostic accuracyHow test development has evolved over time and why this matters Why the same cut-off score shouldn’t apply across all testsThe math behind using two norm-referenced tests, and why it may complicate rather than clarify in some casesOther reasons we test beyond diagnosis (treatment planning, severity, monitoring progress)How do we do we to “sell” the concept of dynamic assessment to administratorsCase studies that show the pitfalls of over-reliance on standardized scoresMisconceptions clinicians often hold, and what they should know about assessmentDifferences in state eligibility standards, and what this means for service decisionsThis series is part myth-busting, part practical strategies, and part advocacy playbook—perfect for clinicians who want to move beyond compliance-driven evaluations toward assessments that truly reflect students’ needs.Destiny Johnson, M.S., CCC-SLP, is a bilingual speech-language pathologist (English/Spanish) with a deep passion for culturally responsive assessment and treatment practices, as well as advocating for policy change. She has presented on dynamic assessment at the CSHA Convergence 2024, focusing on the importance of dynamic assessment in bilingual children. Destiny has experience working as a school-based SLP, in private practice, and in early intervention. She is also the founder and CEO of Multimodal Communication Speech Clinic P.C.Connect with Destiny on Instagram @destinyjohnsonslp, on her private practice website here, and on LinkedIn here.Listen to Destiny’s previous episode on De Facto Leaders here: EP 187: Dynamic Assessment: Evaluations are a process, not a test (with Destiny Johnson)Tiffany Shahoumian-Ruiz is a bilingual high school SLP from Southern California who has primarily worked in the school systems and has experience at both the elementary and secondary level. She’s also a member of Language Therapy Advance Foundations, and is involved in state and local advocacy work relating to dynamic assessments and special education eligibility.Connect with Tiffany on Instagram @tiffany.shahoumianListen to Tiffany’s previous episode on De Facto Leaders here: High school language therapy: Do we still have time to make an impact? (with Tiffany Shahoumian-Ruiz)In this episode, I mention Language Therapy Advance Foundations, my program that gives SLPs and other service providers create a system for language therapy. You can learn more about the program here.Additional Resources Mentioned in the episode:Daub, O., Cunningham, B. J., Bagatto, M. P., Johnson, A. M., Kwok, E. Y., Smyth, R. E., & Oram Cardy, J. (2021). Adopting a conceptual validity framework for testing in speech-language pathology. American Journal of Speech-Language Pathology, 30(4), 1894–1908. https://doi.org/10.1044/2021_AJSLP-20-00032Spaulding, T. J., Plante, E., & Farinella, K. A. (2006). Eligibility criteria for language impairment: Is the low end of normal always appropriate? Language, Speech, and Hearing Services in Schools, 37(1), 61–72. https://doi.org/10.1044/0161-1461(2006/007)DYMOND Norm-Referenced Dynamic AssessmentBilingual English-Spanish Assessment (BESA) We’re thrilled to be sponsored by IXL. IXL’s comprehensive teaching and learning platform for math, language arts, science, and social studies is accelerating achievement in 95 of the top 100 U.S. school districts. Loved by teachers and backed by independent research from Johns Hopkins University, IXL can help you do the following and more:Simplify and streamline technologySave teachers’ timeReliably meet Tier 1 standardsImprove student performance on state assessments🚀 Ready to see why leading districts trust IXL for their educational needs? Visit IXL.com/BE today to learn more about how IXL can elevate your school or district.