First of Kind

How can being a playwright prepare one for designing social intelligence?
Jason Yuan is the CEO and founder of Hivemind. A former Apple designer, he pioneered MercuryOS, an early vision of intent-based computing, then cofounded Dot, a personal AI companion with long-term narrative memory. He now sets off to build a second AI startup inspired by the Madonna song “Future Lovers.”
In this conversation with Soleio, Jason explains why Hivemind runs on principles instead of rules, why every relationship is a story with shared authorship, and why his product motto is “for the plot.”
Jason makes the case that the best products, like the best stories, are based on truth. A truth that is fundamentally plural.

00:00 Own Your Story, Do It True
00:49 Costumes, Stages, then World-Building
03:03 Hivemind in the Wild
08:42 From MercuryOS to Dot
13:20 Did You Make a Startup to Fix Yourself?
16:47 Every Relationship is a Story
19:35 The Graveyard Before Hivemind
22:25 Can Jason See Gotham?
28:13 Do It for The Plot!
29:13 Designing the Hivemind launch
32:48 The Information Market
34:45 Making Work That Feels True
41:02 Being Known Is the Most Wonderful Thing

S3:E02 Jason Yuan: For the Plot
Hosted by Soleio https://x.com/soleio @soleio
Coproduced with Room 3: https://room3nyc.com @room3nyc

Jason Yuan: https://x.com/jasonyuan

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What can a dragon painted in a single stroke teach us about software?
Guillermo Rauch is the founder and CEO of Vercel. Growing up in Argentina, he taught himself English in order to teach himself programming, then went on to create Socket.io and other foundational technology for the real-time web. Along the way, he developed a cunning designer’s eye that became the competitive advantage for what is now a multi-billion dollar venture.
In this conversation with Soleio, Guillermo explains why he designed Vercel’s first command line in Sketch before writing any code, why layout shift erodes trust, and why his company won’t commit any “random acts of AI.”
Guillermo makes the case for why he’s not just chief executive. He is also chief designer.
00:00 Human Effort Is Still Underrated
00:44 Chief Executive, Chief Designer
02:33 Two Bets: Software and English
05:15 Gmail Was My Siren Call
11:06 Exposure Hours
14:49 Layout Shift and the One Stroke Dragon
17:10 No Random Acts of Al
25:17 Can Agents Have Taste?
30:15 Software Factories and Agent Customers
34:59 Everything Is Communication
38:04 A New American Story
41:52 Lifemaxxing
S3:E01 Guillermo Rauch: One Stroke Dragon
Hosted by Soleio and produced by Room 3: https://room3nyc.com @room3nyc
Guillermo Rauch: https://x.com/rauchg · https://rauchg.com
First of Kind is powered by
Framer: https://framer.com
Noon: https://noon.design
Grok Bot: https://x.ai/bot
Ramp: https://ramp.com
Vercel: https://vercel.com
Granola: https://granola.ai
Profound: https://tryprofound.com
Website: https://firstofkind.com
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What do Anthropic, Facebook, Pinterest and Stripe all have in common?

Everett Katigbak has played a foundational creative role at some of the most iconic brands in technology. His film work documents the stories of seminal figures who have shaped culture, such as his documentary projects on Stewart Brand and Luis Valdez.

In this in-depth conversation at his beautiful San Francisco home, Everett describes the “golden thread” that weaves through his non-linear career path, the importance of humanizing infrastructure, and why he believes your side hustle is actually your “true form.” 

As of this recording, Everett has set out on his own to develop an independent creative practice. After years behind the camera, tech’s “brand guru” steps out in front of it.

00:00 Intro: “Your side hustle is your true form”
03:01 Making Facebook Feel Human
05:04 Getting Hired Because You Don’t Fit
08:10 Why San Francisco? Place Before Job
11:33 Analog Research Lab origins & mantras
13:35 Propaganda, Self-Talk, and Shaping Company Culture
16:32 Designing for Engagement vs. Meaning
17:18 Living in Contradictions: Anachronist Meets Futurist
19:27 How to Pick the Right Company (A Nose for What’s Next)
21:03 Expansion vs. Mastery: A Different Kind of Career Path
24:00 Going Independent
26:24 Inside Cursor as a “Cultural Sleuth”
28:49 Stories of Unseen Figures: Luis Valdez, Stewart Brand
32:00 Closing: Advice for Future Pioneers

S2:E6 Everett Katigbak: Indie Streak
Hosted by Soleio and produced by Room 3: room3nyc.com @room3nyc

First of Kind is powered by our sponsors:
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Cursor — cursor.com
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What if you designed a new class of vehicle from the ground up?

Joseph Cohen first cofounded Universe, the mobile-first website builder, before turning his attention to the physical world. He and his brother Eddie Cohen now run Infinite Machine, an automotive company reimagining how people move through cities — not with cars, but with something entirely new, starting with the electric motorcycle.

We met at Infinite Machine's headquarters in New York City, where Joe walked us through the design philosophy behind “non-car” vehicles, why electrification unlocks radical new form factors, and what it means to bet on autonomous people over autonomous cars.

00:00 – Intro: Color Outside the Lines
01:50 – A New Symbol for Freedom
05:52 – The Stolen Vespa
09:49 – The P1 vs. The Vision Pro
12:52 – Hard Modernism
17:26 – Painters Who Paint Factories
19:42 – Ten Times the Trips
23:33 – The Vespa Has No Engine
27:51 – Ask New Questions
32:00 – The Company as Medium
34:11 – Outro: What Memories Will You Make

S2:E5 Joseph Cohen: Infinite Ride
Hosted by Soleio and produced by Room 3: room3nyc.com @room3nyc

First of Kind is powered by our sponsors:
Framer — framer.com
Cursor — cursor.com
Vercel — vercel.com
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Website: firstofkind.com
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When do you know to pivot or surrender?

Koen Bok and Jorn van Dijk co-founded Framer, the web design platform that helps designers ship beautiful sites fast. 55% of YC companies run on it. Designers love it. But Framer almost didn't make it.

What began as a high-fidelity prototyping tool born inside Facebook's design culture became—after a near-death pivot five years in—the premier site builder for designers who ship. 

Over drinks at the Lone Palm in San Francisco, Koen and Jorn recall what it took to step back from the brink of oblivion and chart a new course — for themselves and the field of digital design.

00:00 Intro: Lone Palm, Last Call
01:34 What is Framer Today?
02:39 Pick a Problem You Love
06:14 Three Interactions to Fifty
08:20 Rough Riding / Why VC is Good
11:38 Three Options Left
14:31 The Pivotal Lunch
20:46 Act III: Solving the Walkie-Talkie
29:08 Artistry meets Wall Street
32:20 Stay Weird, Keep Building

Special thanks to Jane Seabrook and the Lone Palm team for permitting us to film the first ever video podcast at their storied bar.

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Koen Bok & Jorn van Dijk: Framer Reloaded
First of Kind, S2:E4
Hosted by Soleio and produced by Room 3: room3nyc.com

First of Kind is powered by our sponsors:
Framer — framer.com
Cursor — cursor.com
Vercel — vercel.com
Profound — tryprofound.com

Website: www.firstofkind.com
𝕏: x.com/firstofkind
Threads: threads.com/firstofkind_
Instagram: instagram.com/firstofkind_
Hashtag: #FirstofKind