"No Trust" by Zero Trust Forum

In this episode of the No Trust podcast, Chase Cunningham discusses the evolution of Zero Trust, reflecting on the growth and challenges faced in 2025 and looking ahead to 2026.

The conversation covers the hype cycle of Zero Trust, the importance of leadership in strategy implementation, the need for cultural shifts, and the metrics that matter in measuring success.

The discussion also touches on the role of AI in cybersecurity and the future of Zero Trust as a standard practice in organizations.

Key Takeaways:

• 2025 was a year of significant international growth for Zero Trust.
• The Zero Trust hype cycle has transitioned to a phase of practicality.
• Leadership is crucial for the continuous execution of Zero Trust strategies.
• Organizations often misinterpret Zero Trust as a completed project rather than an ongoing strategy.
• Incentives in cybersecurity need to shift from punitive measures to positive reinforcement.
• Cultural challenges in adopting Zero Trust can hinder its effectiveness.
• Metrics should focus on real-world outcomes rather than superficial statistics.
• Zero Trust is becoming a necessary standard for modern businesses.
• Technical debt poses a significant challenge for legacy organizations in adopting Zero Trust.
• The future of Zero Trust will likely see it integrated as a default practice in new organizations.

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What is the Zero Trust Forum about?  It’s about empowering zero trust security professionals with strategies, architecture, and real world journeys to secure the digital future, the right way!

Follow the Zero Trust Forum on LinkedIn www.linkedin.com/company/zero-trust-forum/.

Follow Jaye Tillson on LinkedIn - www.linkedin.com/in/jaye-tillson/

Follow John Spiegel on LinkedIn - www.linkedin.com/in/john-spiegel-2011543/

In this episode of the No Trust podcast, John Spiegel engages with cybersecurity expert Joshua Copeland, who shares his insights on the fundamental flaws in the cybersecurity landscape.

They discuss the leadership vacuum in the industry, the pitfalls of compliance theater, and the overwhelming vendor hype that complicates tool selection.

Joshua emphasizes the need for a proactive approach to security, aligning cybersecurity with business objectives, and the importance of effective communication with leadership.

The conversation culminates in actionable takeaways for cybersecurity leaders looking to improve their strategies and outcomes.

Key Takeaways:

• Cybersecurity has a leadership vacuum that needs addressing.
• Compliance does not equate to security; it's often just theater.
• Organizations suffer from tool sprawl and lack of strategy.
• Vendor hype can distort risk perception and lead to poor decisions.
• Security leaders must communicate in business terms to gain support.
• Proactive security measures can prevent costly breaches.
• Understanding the business is crucial for effective cybersecurity leadership.
• Cybersecurity can be a revenue-generating function if aligned with business goals.
• Leverage existing tools before chasing new ones.
• Focus on redesigning critical processes for better security outcomes.

Follow & Subscribe on all Podcast platforms.

What is the Zero Trust Forum about?  It’s about empowering zero trust security professionals with strategies, architecture, and real world journeys to secure the digital future, the right way!

Follow the Zero Trust Forum on LinkedIn www.linkedin.com/company/zero-trust-forum/.

Follow Jaye Tillson on LinkedIn - www.linkedin.com/in/jaye-tillson/

Follow John Spiegel on LinkedIn - www.linkedin.com/in/john-spiegel-2011543/

In this episode, Den Jones shares his journey from Scotland to becoming a prominent figure in cybersecurity, discussing the evolving role of the CISO, the skills gap, and the importance of accountability.

He emphasizes the need for effective communication with executives and the challenges posed by legacy systems.

Den also reflects on leadership lessons learned from past mistakes and provides insights into implementing Zero Trust strategies.

The conversation concludes with advice for aspiring leaders and a light-hearted discussion about food.

Key Takeaways:

• Den Jones shares his journey from Scotland to the US.
• The role of the CISO has evolved significantly in recent years.
• CISOs face increasing accountability and regulatory pressures.
• There is a skills gap in cybersecurity, often due to employer expectations.
• Legacy systems pose significant challenges for security teams.
• Effective communication with executives is crucial for success.
• Celebrating small wins can motivate teams and improve morale.
• Zero Trust implementation requires understanding the audience's needs.
• Leadership involves learning from mistakes and seeking mentorship.
• The future of the CISO role may involve blending with CIO responsibilities.

Follow & Subscribe on all Podcast platforms.

What is the Zero Trust Forum about?  It’s about empowering zero trust security professionals with strategies, architecture, and real world journeys to secure the digital future, the right way!

Follow the Zero Trust Forum on LinkedIn www.linkedin.com/company/zero-trust-forum/.

Follow Jaye Tillson on LinkedIn - www.linkedin.com/in/jaye-tillson/

Follow John Spiegel on LinkedIn - www.linkedin.com/in/john-spiegel-2011543/

In this episode, Jaye and John welcome Jerry Chapman, a leading expert in Zero Trust security.

They discuss Jerry's journey into cybersecurity, the misconceptions surrounding Zero Trust, and the importance of understanding it as a journey rather than a one-time project.

Jerry shares insights on the Zero Trust blueprint, which consists of four phases: readiness, assessment, strategy, and metrics.

The conversation also delves into the challenges organizations face in implementing Zero Trust, the significance of user experience, and the need for continuous iteration and learning.

Jerry emphasizes that data and application security are often the weakest areas in organizations and highlights the importance of evaluating current capabilities to start the Zero Trust journey effectively.

Key Takeaways:

• Zero Trust is a journey, not a one-time project.
• Misconceptions about Zero Trust often focus on technology rather than process.
• Organizations need to assess their readiness for Zero Trust implementation.
• The Zero Trust blueprint consists of four phases: readiness, assessment, strategy, and metrics.
• Understanding business assets and protect surfaces is crucial for Zero Trust.
• Data and application security are often the weakest areas in organizations.
• Organizations can start their Zero Trust journey without having everything in place.
• User experience is critical in the adoption of Zero Trust principles.
• Metrics for success in Zero Trust implementation can be challenging to define.
• Continuous iteration and learning from customer interactions are essential for improving the Zero Trust framework.

Follow & Subscribe on all Podcast platforms.

What is the Zero Trust Forum about?  It’s about empowering zero trust security professionals with strategies, architecture, and real world journeys to secure the digital future, the right way!

Follow the Zero Trust Forum on LinkedIn www.linkedin.com/company/zero-trust-forum/.

Follow Jaye Tillson on LinkedIn - www.linkedin.com/in/jaye-tillson/

Follow John Spiegel on LinkedIn - www.linkedin.com/in/john-spiegel-2011543/

In this episode, Jaye Tillson and John Spiegel engage with Jason Garbis of Numberline Security to explore the often misunderstood concept of Zero Trust and its associated maturity models.

They discuss the importance of viewing Zero Trust as a strategy rather than a mere technology, emphasizing the need for cultural change within organizations.

The conversation delves into common misconceptions, the role of maturity models in assessing security posture, and the necessity of engaging stakeholders beyond IT and security teams.

Jason shares insights on how to effectively communicate Zero Trust initiatives to procurement teams and the complexities of measuring success in these initiatives.

The episode concludes with a discussion on the continuous journey of Zero Trust adoption and the importance of embedding security by design in organizational processes.

Key Takeaways:

• Zero Trust is a strategy, not just a technology.
• Maturity models help organizations assess their security posture.
• Common misconceptions include viewing Zero Trust as a product to buy.
• Successful Zero Trust implementation requires cultural change.
• Engaging stakeholders outside of IT is crucial for success.
• Zero Trust should be embedded in organizational processes.
• Communication with procurement teams is essential for effective vendor evaluation.
• Measuring success in Zero Trust initiatives is complex but necessary.
• Continuous improvement is key in Zero Trust adoption.
• Zero Trust is a journey, not a destination.

Follow & Subscribe on all Podcast platforms.

What is the Zero Trust Forum about?  It’s about empowering zero trust security professionals with strategies, architecture, and real world journeys to secure the digital future, the right way!

Follow the Zero Trust Forum on LinkedIn www.linkedin.com/company/zero-trust-forum/.

Follow Jaye Tillson on LinkedIn - www.linkedin.com/in/jaye-tillson/

Follow John Spiegel on LinkedIn - www.linkedin.com/in/john-spiegel-2011543/