Unchained

Taylor Monahan ties the Bitget hack to North Korea and the crew asks why THORChain still avoids the scrutiny Tornado Cash got.

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Quick favor: We’re deciding what Unchained does next; new shows, stream times, what’s worth paying for.

⁠Our listener survey⁠ takes five minutes, it’s anonymous, and I read the write-in answers myself. Everyone who takes it can enter a drawing for a free year of Unchained Premium or Bits + Bips Premium. Open through Sunday, October 18.

— Laura

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Attackers took $388 million from Bitget without ever getting its private keys. Opsek founder Pablo Sabbatella explains that the way in was a zero-day in a third-party security product the exchange relied on.

Sabbatella, who now sits on Arbitrum's Security Council, joins Kain Warwick, Taylor Monahan, and Austin Griffith to trace the hack. Monahan attributes it to North Korea's TraderTraitor group and flags how fast the funds left Arbitrum, while the hosts ask why THORChain, which has halted its chain and reallocated balances before, still handles stolen funds.

They also cover NEAR's SHIELD anomaly detection, reports of rogue AI agents hacking outside systems, whether retail should get the upside of a $2 trillion Anthropic IPO, and Vitalik Buterin's 2030 roadmap for Ethereum.

Warwick's case: the harder the problem, the more superintelligence helps, and Ethereum is one of the hardest problems there is.

Hosts:

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Kain Warwick⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ - Host of Uneasy Money and Founder of Infinex and Synthetix

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Taylor Monahan⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ - Co-host of Uneasy Money and Security Expert

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Austin Griffith⁠⁠ - Co-host of Uneasy Money and Builder Enablement at Ethereum Foundation

Guest:

Pablo Sabbatella - Founder at Opsek

Timestamps

🚨 02:32 How Bitget got hit for $388M and covered the losses

🛡️ 08:24 Why Pablo says a third-party security product was the way into Bitget

🕵️ 11:22 Taylor ties the hack to North Korea and highlights their rush to exit Arbitrum

❄️ 13:34 Pablo on why security councils restart the freeze debate every time

⛓️ 14:17 Why Kain says THORChain can't claim it's like Bitcoin and Ethereum

🧭 30:24 How NEAR's Shield blocks funds using behavioral anomaly detection

📣 34:51 1inch: See how 1inch Aqua lets LPs back multiple positions with one token balance at http://unchainedcrypto.com/go/1inch-yt

🤖 36:16 Rogue AI agents are hacking outside systems as the labs eye IPOs

🔓 39:11 Why Pablo thinks the AI labs want to regulate open-source models

📈 48:55 Kain's case for letting retail take the risk on a $2T Anthropic IPO

🧱 01:05:47 Why Kain calls Vitalik's 2030 roadmap the most bullish Ethereum read in years

🏪 01:19:18 Pablo asks whether Ethereum's real challenge is commercial, not technical
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Hunter Biden walks through the $LAPTOP launch, when thin liquidity sent the token to a $317 billion market cap in a minute, and why he says it isn't a scam.

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Quick favor: We're deciding what Unchained does next; new shows, stream times, what's worth paying for.⁠⁠⁠ Our listener survey⁠⁠⁠ takes five minutes, it's anonymous, and I read the write-in answers myself. Everyone who takes it can enter a drawing for a free year of Unchained Premium or Bits + Bips Premium. Open through Sunday, October 18.

— Laura

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In June, Hunter Biden replied to a small account on X that "fiat is a sham" and the banking class is corrupt. His next move was $LAPTOP, a memecoin he says has the opposite tokenomics of the $TRUMP token.

Hunter joins Laura Shin to trace his path into crypto, from the UN World Food Programme’s digital wallets for refugees (originally covered on Unchained in 2018) to The Internet of Money. He walks through $LAPTOP's first minutes, when a market maker seeded about $5,000 of liquidity and the token briefly showed a $317 billion market cap, and answers critics who call it a scam.

He also lays out the token's prediction market burn mechanism, argues the Clarity Act died because the administration wouldn't bend on ethics rules covering the Trump family, and challenges Elizabeth Warren for siding with the banks.

Host:

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained

Guest:

⁠⁠⁠⁠Hunter Biden - Artist, Author, and Recovery Advocate

Timestamps

🎨 01:26 How a blockchain-related initiative at the UN World Food Programme led Hunter to crypto

🏛️ 07:34 Why Hunter says most Democrats only know crypto through Trump's 'grift'

💧 12:47 1inch Aqua: See how LPs back multiple positions with one balance at http://unchainedcrypto.com/go/1inch-yt

💻 13:46 Why Hunter launched $LAPTOP and what he says went wrong at its debut

🔍 21:14 Hunter answers critics who call $LAPTOP the scam he accuses Trump of

🎲 23:52 How $LAPTOP's built-in prediction market burns tokens or funds charity

⚖️ 33:35 Hunter's case against World Liberty Financial and the Trump family business

🗳️ 46:47 Can Democrats revive the Clarity Act if they take back Congress?

🏦 50:01 Why Hunter can't understand Elizabeth Warren siding with the banks
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In their final episode on Unchained, Katherine Kirkpatrick Bos, Jessi Brooks, and Vy Le share the advice they give women entering crypto. Plus, Vy on the Senate meeting after FTX.

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Quick favor: We're deciding what Unchained does next; new shows, stream times, what's worth paying for.⁠⁠⁠ Our listener survey⁠⁠⁠ takes five minutes, it's anonymous, and I read the write-in answers myself. Everyone who takes it can enter a drawing for a free year of Unchained Premium or Bits + Bips Premium. Open through Sunday, October 18.

— Laura

========================================================

After more than a year of amplifying women's voices in crypto, DEX in the City is signing off from Unchained, and its hosts skip the week's news to share the advice they give people trying to break into the industry.

Katherine Kirkpatrick Bos, Jessi Brooks, and Vy Le debate whether lawyers need to be on X, why "getting into crypto" now means learning perps, tokens, and prediction markets at once, and why Katherine believes women in male-dominated rooms have to be the adult in the room.

Vy recounts breaking down in a Senate office days after FTX collapsed, a story she says she had barely told anyone, and what it taught her about separating the technology from the people who abuse it. Jessi recalls begging the FBI around 2016 to take cases involving terrorists using Bitcoin, a measure of how far the industry has traveled since institutions laughed it off.

Host:

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Katherine Kirkpatrick Bos⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host of DEX in the City and General Counsel of Chainlink

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Jessi Brooks⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, General Counsel at Ribbit Capital⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Vy Le⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ - Co-host of DEX in the City and General Counsel of Veda

Timestamps

🎙️ 01:48 Why the hosts are skipping the news for their final episode on Unchained

🧭 03:25 Jessi's case against 'getting into crypto,' and the debate over X

⚖️ 12:15 Why KK tells women in crypto they have to be the adult in the room

🪞 16:45 Jessi on 'don't lose yourself,' and Vy on why the loudest critics aren't the majority

💧 23:40 1inch Aqua: Back multiple liquidity positions with the same token balance at http://unchainedcrypto.com/go/1inch-yt

🌊 24:54 How the hosts keep marching through crypto's roughest stretches

💔 29:22 Vy on why crypto can't be your whole identity, and her Senate meeting after FTX

🏰 36:13 The strangest crypto moments: Versailles, a Florida offsite, North Korea

🙌 45:10 The women and allies the hosts credit for paving the way
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Bitget lost $388 million — and days later, CEO Gracy Chen says scammers posing as a major investment team targeted her.

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Quick favor: We're deciding what Unchained does next; new shows, stream times, what's worth paying for.⁠⁠ Our listener survey⁠⁠ takes five minutes, it's anonymous, and I read the write-in answers myself. Everyone who takes it can enter a drawing for a free year of Unchained Premium or Bits + Bips Premium. Open through Sunday, October 18.

— Laura

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On September 24, attackers used a zero-day in a third-party security product to slip fraudulent withdrawal commands into Bitget's wallet system, pulling out about $388 million across chains from Ethereum and XRP to Zcash.

Bitget CEO Gracy Chen joins Laura Shin to reconstruct the attack, from test transfers that stayed under risk thresholds to her team's call to switch wallets back on mid-attack and sweep hot and warm funds into cold storage. She lays out how the exchange's protection fund covered users and why reopened withdrawals showed an early net inflow.

Then comes the industry response. Tether, Circle, and NEAR Intents froze funds, THORChain declined her request, and only $632K is frozen so far. Chen also describes scammers impersonating an investment firm to target her after the hack. Her case that "permissionless doesn't mean neutral" puts a hard question to DeFi.

Host:

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained

Guest:

⁠Gracy Chen - CEO of Bitget

Timestamps

🚨 01:50 How attackers used a third-party zero-day to fake withdrawal commands

❄️ 07:15 Why Bitget switched wallets back on mid-attack to sweep funds to cold storage

💧 14:30 1inch Aqua: See how LPs back multiple positions with the same token balance at http://unchainedcrypto.com/go/1inch-sn

⛓️ 15:37 Why the hackers were able to transact even after withdrawals were paused

🧊 19:04 How Tether, Circle, and NEAR Intents froze funds, and why recovery is harder

🕵️ 24:05 ZachXBT's shift on the Bitget hack and his earlier pump-and-dump claims

🛡️ 30:01 NEAR Intents vs. THORChain: does permissionless mean neutral?

💰 41:55 Why Bitget built its protection fund in 2022 and how it covered the loss

🎭 48:17 How scammers posed as an investment team to target Gracy after the hack

📈 01:01:32 A net ETH inflow after withdrawals reopened, and whether the IPO is still on
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Ran Neuner argues crypto has finally found product-market fit, and a BlackRock report on AI agents and blockchain rails convinced him the thesis may be much bigger than he thought.

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========================================================

Quick favor: We're deciding what Unchained does next; new shows, stream times, what's worth paying for.⁠ Our listener survey⁠ takes five minutes, it's anonymous, and I read the write-in answers myself. Everyone who takes it can enter a drawing for a free year of Unchained Premium or Bits + Bips Premium. Open through Sunday, October 18.

— Laura

========================================================

The 10-year Treasury yield just hit its highest level since 2007, and Ran Neuner thinks Scott Bessent will answer by bringing more money to the party. Neuner, founder and CEO of Crypto Banter, makes the case to Laura Shin that this is not just another Bitcoin cycle but crypto's first real bull market.

His argument rests on two use cases. The first is social trading, which he describes as the world's biggest social network and casino "having a baby," with Hyperliquid and Pump.fun earning millions of dollars a day. The second is AI agents: he cites a study projecting one billion agents by 2029 and a new BlackRock report arguing machine-to-machine payments favor blockchain rails over ACH and card networks.

They also cover why he calls RWAs magazines moved online, whether AI IPOs will drain crypto liquidity, and why he thinks Zcash may be more useful than Bitcoin. If he's right, his own 7x altcoin projection may prove conservative.

Host:

⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Laura Shin⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠, Host / Unchained

Guest:

Ran Neuner - Founder and CEO of Crypto Banter

Timestamps

🏦 01:47 Why Ran thinks Bessent is engineering 'the ultimate short squeeze'

📊 04:45 Why an ETH/BTC breakout signals crypto's first real product-market fit

🎰 09:35 Social trading: a social network and a casino 'having a baby'

💧 14:03 1inch Aqua: Back multiple liquidity positions with one wallet balance at http://unchainedcrypto.com/go/1inch-yt

🤖 15:06 How a billion AI agents could send altcoins far past Bitcoin

⏱️ 29:14 Why Ran thinks AI agents will borrow against compute and tell time in blocks

🌐 37:01 Will AI IPOs drain crypto liquidity? Ran on why AI isn't the dot-com bubble

🛡️ 40:05 Privacy vs. social trading, and why Ran calls Zcash 'more useful than Bitcoin'
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