The Peel with Turner Novak

• How the World’s Most Active Angel Investor Operates | Ed Lando, Founder of Pareto Holdings

  Ed Lando is the Co-founder of Pareto, where he’s been an early investor in over 25 unicorns, started and incubated over 10 companies, and was recently named the most active angel investor in the world according to Crunchbase.We get into how Ed first got started angel investing, how he built up deal flow, why he’s historically kept a low profile, and why he hasn’t raised outside capital.We also talk concentration vs diversification, why there’s many ways to build successful companies, advice on hiring your first employees, and his playbook for incubating companies at Pareto, which is where he focuses most of his time. Timestamps:(0:00) Intro(2:51) Getting into angel investing(3:58) Debating high vs low PR strategies(8:27) How to start building deal flow when angel investing(10:00) Pareto: first investor in people leaving school or their job(12:05) Evolving from angel to fund(14:57) Why Ed didn’t raise outside capital(20:33) Concentration vs diversification(28:29) Investing in non-sexy categories(32:50) There’s no one right way to build a company(36:03) When to go against traditional wisdom(39:36) Lessons from his anti-portfolio(45:59) Ed’s close relationship with his parents((49:04) How we’re using AI(54:04) Incubating companies(58:38) Investing beyond spreadsheets and DCF models(1:05:49) How to trust your intuition investing (1:09:47) How to move fast(1:14:24) What most people get wrong when incubating companies(1:18:40) How to hire your first employees(1:26:27) Navigating hype when building and investing1:29:59 Venture math and the Power Law1:35:33 How Ed and Pareto’s strategy might break1:38:45 Differences between the US and EuropeReferencedPareto: https://pareto20.com/Misfit Market: https://www.misfitsmarket.com/Catalina Crunch: https://catalinacrunch.com/Zamp: https://zamp.com/Magnus Carlsen on Joe Rogan: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ybuJ_nIXwGEFollow EdTwitter: https://x.com/edwardlandoLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/edwardlando/Substack: https://edwardlando.substack.com/Follow TurnerTwitter: https://twitter.com/TurnerNovakLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/turnernovakSubscribe to my newsletter to get every episode + the transcript in your inbox every week: https://www.thespl.it/

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• Alloy’s Unconventional Path to $1.5B with Tommy Nicholas, Co-founder and CEO

  Tommy Nicholas is the Co-founder and CEO of Alloy, the identity and fraud prevention platform trusted by over 700 financial service companies.Our conversation explores the early days of fintech, why more consumer financial protections actually lead to more fraud, and gets into the weeds of various tactics he’s learned building a technical platform company like Alloy.We talk about embracing that the hard parts of company building are actually the best parts, why you’re most likely to give up when things first start getting better, using hands-on sales implementations in the early days to gave Alloy product market fit on steroids, how hiring changes as you scale, getting 100’s of no’s over 20 months raising their Seed round, and why TAM doesn’t matter.Thanks to Charley Ma for his help brainstorming topics for Tommy!Thanks to Numeral for supporting this episode, the end-to-end platform for sales tax and compliance. Try them here: https://bit.ly/NumeralThePeelTimestamps:(3:56) The platform to manage fraud(5:48) What fintech risk was like in the early 2010’s(14:34) Why company building never gets easier(19:30) Reasons the hard stuff is actually the good stuff(24:00) You’re most likely to give up when things start getting better(33:47) Doing hands-on sales implementation to get PMF on steroids(42:26) Deciding when PLG or hands-on sales will work best(52:33) Why more consumer financial protections leads to more fraud(58:14) 20 months to raise $2m vs $200m from a spreadsheet(1:06:32) “Make yourself look like a good investment”(1:10:14) Why TAM doesn’t matter(1:14:35) How to hire collaborative problem solvers(1:24:38) Why Alloy didn’t do much marketing early onReferencedTry Alloy: https://www.alloy.com/Charley Ma’s Pod Episode: https://youtu.be/5cxgB1_q2lwTry Artie: https://www.artie.com/Follow TommyTwitter: https://x.com/tommyrvaLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tommynicholasFollow TurnerTwitter: https://twitter.com/TurnerNovakLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/turnernovakSubscribe to my newsletter to get every episode + the transcript in your inbox every week: https://www.thespl.it/

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• The $750 Billion AI Opportunity in Customer Service | Mike Murchison, Co-founder and CEO of Ada

  Mike Murchison is the Co-founder and CEO of Ada, the AI-powered customer service automation platform.Ada’s product and scale puts Mike at the forefront at how AI is changing software and labor markets, and this conversation felt like both a glimpse into the future, and a look into the past, at a story of pure grit and determination, working seven customer service jobs at once.We talk about why management capabilities becomes even more important in AI-native companies, how customer service is changing from a cost center to a revenue driver, and how to talk to customers more as you scale.We also get into why AI is still underhyped, what truly AI native software looks like, the realities of selling enterprise AI software today, and advice for anyone building an AI agent from scratch.Thanks to Boris Wertz and Fahd Ananta for their help brainstorming topics for Mike!Timestamps:(00:00) Intro(03:49) Making customer service extraordinary for everyone(05:44) Management becomes more important in AI-first companies(12:13) From customer inquiry to solution in production, fully autonomously(16:01) Why companies talk to customers less as they grow(20:36) Creating new products from customer service data(22:45) Broken incentives in customer service(26:10) Working 7 customer service agent jobs at once for a year(37:19) Why pivoting to Ada felt like failure(46:11) How Mike would build an AI agent from scratch today(49:15) Ways AI will change how we build and manage companies(56:44) Why the best managers are great users of AI(1:00:27) How the top 1% of people are using LLMs(1:06:22) Realities of selling enterprise AI software today(1:11:02) Building a sales team from scratch(1:15:21) Reflecting on Ada’s scale + doubling the last six months(1:16:41) Biggest software category of all-time ($750B)(1:19:51) Why AI is still under hyped(1:21:01) Ego is the biggest inhibitor to AI adoption(1:23:33) How AI will fuel explosion of creativity and productivity(1:25:20) Large companies will benefit the most from AI(1:27:41) Multi-modal language models and autonomous (computersReferencedTry Ada: https://www.ada.cx/Follow MikeTwitter: https://twitter.com/mimurchisonLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/mikemurchisonFollow TurnerTwitter: https://twitter.com/TurnerNovakLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/turnernovakSubscribe to my newsletter to get every episode + the transcript in your inbox every week: https://www.thespl.it/

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• Why Founders are Moving to Chattanooga, Tennessee to Lock-in | Cam Doody at Brickyard

  Cam Doody is the Co-founder and General Partner of Brickyard, the venture capital firm moving founders to Chattanooga, Tennessee to lock-in with no distractions until they find product market fit.Brickyard is one of the most unique venture firms you’ll ever come across, and we get into how it how it was inspired by a 16x fund based in Chattanooga, why Cam and his co-founders started it during ZIRP, and why they hope everyone copies their model.We also get into Cam’s startup Bellhops, which he started in 2011 and has since grown into the third largest moving company in the US. We talk running a local services business, why 5-star review systems don’t work, and how U-Haul almost killed Bellhops overnight back in 2016.Thanks to Nader Khalil, Matt Harb, Austin Beveridge, and Spencer Levitt for their help brainstorming topics for Cam!Timestamps:(0:00) Intro(03:33) Chattanooga: Dirty manufacturing city to high tech(05:23) Brickyard’s precursor, the Lamp Post Group (a 16x fund)(09:46) How ZIRP screwed up early stage investing(13:49) What is Brickayrd?(21:14) Getting Brickyard off the ground in 2021(26:25) 100+ year old rug warehouse + maintenance nightmares(33:13) Cam wants everyone to copy Brickyard(36:31) Why economic development startup programs don’t work(38:59) YC teams doing Brickyard to escape the Trough of Sorrow(44:07) How Brickyard companies raise Series As(46:10) Nvidia acquiring Brev(52:18) How to deal with a co-founder breakup(55:45) Starting Bellhop to build a better moving company(1:02:27) How U-Haul almost killed them overnight(1:06:54) Marketing tactics for a local services business(1:12:05) Why 5-star review systems don’t work(1:18:16) How Cam’s view of VC’s changed after becoming one(1:20:37) Ways VC’s actually add value(1:25:05) The thesis for Bitcoin(1:39:21) Cam’s annual remote desert island vacationReferencedCheck out Brickyard: https://www.justlaybrick.com/The Trough of Sorrow: https://andrewchen.com/after-the-techcrunch-bump-life-in-the-trough-of-sorrow/Bellhops: https://www.getbellhops.com/Follow CamTwitter: https://www.twitter.com/camdoodyLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cam-doody-b489a124Follow TurnerTwitter: https://twitter.com/TurnerNovakLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/turnernovakSubscribe to my newsletter to get every episode + the transcript in your inbox every week: https://www.thespl.it/

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• Zero to $20m ARR in Two Months: Inside Bolt’s 7-Year Journey to Overnight Success | Eric Simons, Co-founder & CEO

  Eric Simons is the Co-founder and CEO of StackBlitz, best known for its breakout product Bolt, letting anyone build full stack apps from text, in the browser.Bolt launched in October of 2024, quickly growing from zero to a $20 million revenue run rate in two months, making it one of the fastest growing products ever. But Eric will be the first to tell you it wasn’t an overnight success - the product didn’t even work the first time they tried building it.We go behind the scenes of the seven year journey building the tech that eventually led to Bolt, how to avoid distractions, being capital efficient, living in a frat house for $100/month, and squatting in AOL’s headquarters for $1/day when he was 19.Eric also takes us inside the weeks after Bolt’s viral launch, figuring out a new business model on the fly, his strategy for fundraising and PR, why you should open source your code, Bolt’s playbook for building a community around the product that enabled their viral launch, and how AI is changing software forever.Timestamps:(0:00) Intro(2:24) Building full stack apps from text, in your browser(4:19) Running an operating system in the browser(11:48) Why Bolt failed the first time, almost shutting down the company last summer(20:18) How Bolt went viral from one tweet(28:33) Differences between ChatGPT, Claude, Cursor(39:38) Why AI code gen changes the software world order(42:01) What happened inside Bolt going from zero to $20m ARR in two months(47:32) Not sharing fundraises publicly + his PR strategy(58:57) Why the team never gave up for seven years(1:01:07) Living in a frat house for $100/month(1:04:07) How to be capital efficient(1:09:00) Living on $1/day in AOL’s HQ when he was 19(1:14:01) Inside Bolt’s Series B(1:21:03) Bolt’s hiring and product roadmap(1:32:58) Creating a new inference-based AI business model(1:38:07) Eric's playbook for building a community of users(1:44:05) Why you should open source your codeReferencedTry Bolt: https://bolt.new/Bolt on X: https://x.com/boltdotnewCheck out Webcontainers: https://webcontainers.io/$0 to $4m ARR case study with Anthropic: https://www.anthropic.com/customers/stackblitzBolt’s open source code: https://www.bolt.diy/Bolt / StackBlitz is hiring! https://stackblitz.com/careersEric’s favorite cafe, The Lighthouse SF: https://thelighthousessf.com/Lady Gaga’s “one person” montage: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iRxsX_30tjsLiving inside AOL HQ at 19 years old: https://www.cnet.com/tech/tech-industry/meet-the-tireless-entrepreneur-who-squatted-at-aol/Bloomberg coverage of StackBlitz Series B: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2025-01-21/ai-speech-to-code-startup-stackblitz-is-in-talks-for-a-700-million-valuation?embedded-checkout=trueJoel Spolsky’s blog: https://www.joelonsoftware.com/Follow EricTwitter: https://x.com/ericsimons40LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/eric-simons-a464a664/Follow TurnerTwitter: https://twitter.com/TurnerNovakLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/turnernovakSubscribe to my newsletter to get every episode + the transcript in your inbox every week: https://www.thespl.it/

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