This week on Live Players, Erik Torenberg and Samo Burja discuss geopolitical and societal complexities of the India-Pakistan conflict, examining the historical context, demographic challenges, military capabilities, and potential outcomes of the ongoing tensions between the two nuclear-armed neighbors.
—
📰 Be notified early when Turpentine's drops new publication: https://www.turpentine.co/exclusiveaccess
—SPONSORS:☁️ More than 41,000 businesses have already upgraded to NetSuite by Oracle, the #1 cloud financial system bringing accounting, financial management, inventory, HR, into ONE proven platform. Download the CFO's Guide to AI and Machine learning: https://netsuite.com/102
—LINKS:India: Live Players Analysis: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8GbsYh2kx7Y
Bismarck Analysis: https://brief.bismarckanalysis.com/
—X / TWITTER:@samoburja@eriktorenberg@turpentinemedia—HIGHLIGHTS FROM THE EPISODE:• The India-Pakistan conflict is rooted in the partition of British India.• Both countries have significant military capabilities, including nuclear weapons.• India's large Muslim population poses internal stability challenges during conflicts.• Pakistan's military plays a crucial role in maintaining state cohesion.• The potential for a prolonged war could lead to significant domestic unrest in India.• China's involvement in the region complicates the geopolitical landscape.• The conflict is characterized by a cycle of sporadic fighting and ceasefires.• Misunderstandings about the precariousness of Pakistan's state legitimacy are common.• An expansionist war for India lacks a clear victory scenario.• The historical narratives of both countries shape their current political identities.
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45:33
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45:33
The Almost-Industrial Revolutions of Rome and China
Erik Torenberg and Samo Burja discuss the potential industrial revolutions in history, particularly in the Roman Empire and Song Dynasty China, their technological advancements, economic factors, and the reasons these revolutions didn't reach full fruition.
—
📰 Be notified early when Turpentine's drops new publication: https://www.turpentine.co/exclusiveaccess
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—LINKS:Las Medulas in Spain: https://whc.unesco.org/en/list/803/ Monte Testaccio in Rome: https://www.historyskills.com/classroom/ancient-history/monte-testaccio/?srsltid=AfmBOoonzF0CVGKjzUFs46kkI9fZ-FVcBTDOMAVs8vtFcxH4iKcNx09f
Bismarck Analysis: https://brief.bismarckanalysis.com/
—X / TWITTER:@samoburja@eriktorenberg@turpentinemedia
—HIGHLIGHTS FROM THE EPISODE:
Erik Torenberg and Samo Burja discuss "failed industrial revolutions" throughout history that aren't as widely recognized as the modern Industrial Revolution.
Contrary to the common belief of constant economic progress, human history has shown societies getting richer and then poorer in cycles.
The Roman Empire experienced an industrial revolution different from our modern understanding.
Roman slavery wasn't the reason they didn't industrialize further, as slaves became expensive in later periods.
Water power was extensively utilized by Romans for milling flour, ironworks, sawing wood, and cutting marble at industrial scales.
Romans employed sophisticated engineering, using aqueducts to transport water for power generation in various mechanical applications.
Archaeological evidence reveals hundreds of sites where Romans harnessed water power through complex waterwheel systems.
Romans understood the concept of using heat to generate motion, as demonstrated by Heron of Alexandria's steam engine experiment.
The scale of Roman metal production was so vast it left detectable lead pollution signatures in Greenland ice cores.
Monte Testaccio in Rome, an artificial hill composed entirely of broken pottery fragments, represents industrial-scale production of approximately 53 million amphoras.
Romans mass-produced standardized items including pottery, glassware, statues, and military equipment with interchangeable parts.
The Roman economy featured a sophisticated consumer market with a significant middle class that purchased mass-produced goods.
This era is underappreciated partly because it's concerning that a society on an industrialization trajectory could be interrupted.
Hollywood's portrayal of the era as merely "swords and sandals" fails to capture the advanced mechanical elements that would have appeared almost "steampunk" to modern eyes.
Roman cities like Alexandria were not just centers of taxation but significant production hubs with globalized trade networks.
The Roman Empire might have easily adopted more advanced steam power if they had needed to dig more coal, but their abundant wood and other fuel sources made it unnecessary.
Song Dynasty China in the 12th century represents another advanced technological society that still fell to military challenges despite its innovations.
Large-scale shipping over water appears to be a crucial prerequisite for industrialization in all these historical cases.
Industrial revolutions may plateau when growth of non-technological factors (population, territory) fails to keep pace with technological advancement.
The Hellenistic era (particularly Alexandria) is described as "the birthplace of modern science" and worthy of further discussion.
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48:41
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48:41
Is Europe Part of America?
In this episode of Live Players, Samo Burja and Erik Torenberg discuss the global influence of U.S. politics on Western countries, the persistence of Western civilization as a political unit, the synchronization of political interests via the internet, and the potential for significant right-wing and free speech shifts in Europe given increased American cultural influence.
—
📰 Be notified early when Turpentine's drops new publication: https://www.turpentine.co/exclusiveaccess
🙏 Help shape our show by taking our quick listener survey at https://bit.ly/TurpentinePulse
—
RECOMMENDED PODCASTS:
🎙️ Second Opinion: Join Christina Farr, Ash Zenooz and Luba Greenwood as they bring influential entrepreneurs, experts and investors into the ring for candid conversations at the frontlines of healthcare and digital health every week.
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/0A8NwQE976s32zdBbZw6bv
Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/second-opinion-with-christina-farr-ash-zenooz-md-luba/id1759267211
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@SecondOpinionwithChristinaFarr
—
SPONSORS:
☁️ More than 41,000 businesses have already upgraded to NetSuite by Oracle, the #1 cloud financial system bringing accounting, financial management, inventory, HR, into ONE proven platform. Download the CFO's Guide to AI and Machine learning: https://netsuite.com/102
—
LINKS:
Two buttons meme: https://ih1.redbubble.net/image.2365085899.3351/st,small,507x507-pad,600x600,f8f8f8.jpg
The Clash of Civilizations: https://www.amazon.com/Clash-Civilizations-Remaking-World-Order/dp/1451628978
Bismark Analysis: https://brief.bismarckanalysis.com/
—
X / TWITTER:
@samoburja
@eriktorenberg
@turpentinemedia
—
HIGHLIGHTS FROM THE EPISODE:
Western civilization as a political unit continues to exist.
The U.S. presidency significantly influences global politics.
Cultural synchronization is evident across Western nations.
Free speech is becoming a central issue in Europe.
Political priorities in Europe are increasingly aligned with U.S. interests.
Social media plays a crucial role in shaping political discourse.
The concept of democracy in Europe is evolving.
There is a growing demand for free speech in Europe.
The internet's influence on free speech is undeniable.
Political change in the U.S. impacts global political dynamics. European countries lack true sovereignty due to external influences.
Client states like Canada and Europe have significant sway over US politics.
The introduction of free speech in Europe may lead to a rightward shift in politics.
Political identities in Europe are fluid and subject to change.
There is a growing demand for change in European political priorities.
Sovereignty requires both resource independence and a capable population.
Cultural power is often a reflection of military strength.
Admiration for military power influences cultural perceptions globally.
The US's cultural dominance is tied to its military power and commercialized culture.
The relationship between Europe and America is complex and evolving.
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59:18
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59:18
Predicting Humanity’s Interplanetary Future
Samo Burja and Erik Torenberg discuss the future of space colonization, touching on the implications of Mars and lunar settlements, the technological advancements driving space exploration, and how multi-planetary life might reshape human cultures, geopolitical dynamics, and economic structures.
—
📰Be notified early when Turpentine's drops new publication: https://www.turpentine.co/exclusiveaccess
🙏Help shape our show by taking our quick listener survey at https://bit.ly/TurpentinePulse
—
RECOMMENDED PODCASTS:
🎙️Check out Modern Relationships, where Erik Torenberg interviews tech power couples and leading thinkers to explore how ambitious people actually make partnerships work. This season's guests include: Delian Asparouhov & Nadia Asparouhova, Kristen Berman & Phil Levin, Rob Henderson, and Liv Boeree & Igor Kurganov.
Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/id1786227593
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5hJzs0gDg6lRT6r10mdpVg
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@ModernRelationshipsPod
—
SPONSORS:
☁️ More than 41,000 businesses have already upgraded to NetSuite by Oracle, the #1 cloud financial system bringing accounting, financial management, inventory, HR, into ONE proven platform. Download the CFO's Guide to AI and Machine learning: https://netsuite.com/102
—
LINKS:
Starship: https://www.spacex.com/vehicles/starship/
(Pirate Wars) Moon Should Be a State: https://www.piratewires.com/p/moon-should-be-a-state
Artemis: https://www.nasa.gov/feature/artemis/
SLS: https://www.nasa.gov/humans-in-space/space-launch-system/
Boom Supersonic:https://boomsupersonic.com/
Blue Origin: https://www.blueorigin.com/
Referenced Live Players episodes:
The Turbulence of Boeing: Decline and Future Prospects: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1pmCK6CrK4
The Technology That Can Reshape Nations (Desalination): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_gEHhSXECs
Bismark Analysis: https://brief.bismarckanalysis.com/
—
X / TWITTER:
@samoburja
@eriktorenberg
@turpentinemedia
—
HIGHLIGHTS FROM THE EPISODE:
Human civilization may become multi-planetary in the near future.
Economic barriers to space travel are diminishing, making colonization feasible.
International treaties on space may not hold as nations pursue territorial claims.
The moon's resources could lead to a new space race among nations.
Cultural identity on Mars will evolve differently from Earth due to environmental factors.
Genetic engineering may be necessary for human adaptation to Mars.
Martian societies may develop a sense of pride and distinct identity over generations.
Life on Mars could resemble life on a submarine, fostering strong community bonds.
The relationship between Earth and Martian colonies may mirror historical colonial dynamics.
Martians may view Earthlings as privileged and less resilient. Martian communities will likely be isolated and self-sufficient.
Cultural identity on Mars may evolve independently from Earth.
Terraforming Mars could spark cultural debates among settlers.
Technological advancements will shape the culture of space colonies.
The moon may become an industrially important part of the solar system.
Future Martian society will value hard work and frugality.
Genetic adaptations may occur among humans living on different planets.
The colonization of space could lead to a return of genetic diversity.
AI could play a significant role in the future of space colonization.
The solar system has vast resources that will be explored and utilized.
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1:00:27
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1:00:27
Curtis Yarvin and the Evolution of American Political Thought
In this episode of Live Players, Samo Burja and Erik Torenberg discuss Curtis Yarvin's influence on government efficiency ideas, the pitfalls of gridlock and bureaucratic decay, and how transformative figures and strategic decision-making affect national and corporate success.
—
📰 Be notified early when Turpentine's drops new publication: https://www.turpentine.co/exclusiveaccess
🙏 Help shape our show by taking our quick listener survey at https://bit.ly/TurpentinePulse
—
RECOMMENDED PODCASTS:
🎙️Check out Modern Relationships, where Erik Torenberg interviews tech power couples and leading thinkers to explore how ambitious people actually make partnerships work. This season's guests include: Delian Asparouhov & Nadia Asparouhova, Kristen Berman & Phil Levin, Rob Henderson, and Liv Boeree & Igor Kurganov.
Apple: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/id1786227593
Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5hJzs0gDg6lRT6r10mdpVg
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@ModernRelationshipsPod
—
SPONSORS:
☁️ More than 41,000 businesses have already upgraded to NetSuite by Oracle, the #1 cloud financial system bringing accounting, financial management, inventory, HR, into ONE proven platform. Download the CFO's Guide to AI and Machine learning: https://netsuite.com/102
🔐 Vanta automates security compliance and builds trust, helping companies streamline ISO, SOC 2, and AI framework certifications. Learn more at https://vanta.com/complex
—
LINKS:
'The Interview': Curtis Yarvin Says Democracy is Done (The New York Times): https://www.nytimes.com/2025/01/18/magazine/curtis-yarvin-interview.html
Curtis Yarvin on the End of American Democracy (Podcast): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NcSil8NeQq8
Dwarkesh’s tweet: https://x.com/dwarkesh_sp/status/1881776987322376435
Samo’s Tweet: https://x.com/SamoBurja/status/1882525049003164147
Bismark Analysis: https://brief.bismarckanalysis.com/
—
X / TWITTER:
@samoburja
@eriktorenberg
@turpentinemedia
—
HIGHLIGHTS FROM THE EPISODE:
Curtis Yarvin's influence on the tech right is significant.
Natural selection does not apply to corporate functionality.
Leadership is crucial for the adaptability of institutions.
Government accountability is often lacking compared to corporate structures.
The risks of government failure can be catastrophic.
Innovation is stifled by bureaucratic gridlock.
Democracy may not function effectively in a gridlocked system.
Yarvin's vision includes anarcho-capitalist elements.
Government spending can be inefficient and wasteful.
Honesty about trade-offs in governance is essential. The one-child policy in China is a prime example of disastrous governance.
Sweden's COVID policy was more effective than many Western approaches.
Inefficient government can have astronomical costs on society.
Political ideologies are often more aligned than they appear.
Curtis Yarvin's ideas challenge conventional political thought.
Intellectual diversity is crucial for a healthy discourse.
Engaging with controversial thinkers can strengthen our understanding.
The digital age offers new platforms for intellectual exchange.
Societal progress requires harnessing the energies of the nation.
Democracy is not the end of political evolution.
About "Live Players" with Samo Burja and Erik Torenberg
See the world through the eyes of society's greatest rule-breakers. The "Live Players" podcast charts the key individuals shaping our future from first principles across multiple domains: business, politics, philanthropy, and broadcasting from the digital town square
Join host Samo Burja and Erik Torenberg as they analyze the mindsets of today's most intriguing business leaders, investors, and innovators through the lens of their bold actions and contrarian worldviews. You'll come away with a deeper understanding of the development of technology, business, political power, culture and more.
If you want more than soundbites and sensationalism, this podcast delivers reasoned reflections on the live players who renew and transform civilization, whether we ask them to or not.
Topics frequently covered: Business titans, political players, and philanthropists like Elon Musk, Sam Altman, Peter Thiel, George Soros, Donald Trump, and more with the power to remake industries, policies, borders, or societal norms.
Live Players is part of the Turpentine podcast network. Learn more: www.turpentine.co
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